Reddit reviews Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents

Here are some excellent books on narcissistic parenting and its upshots (all available on amazon.com, etc):

Nina Brown's Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents

Eleanor Payson's The Wizard of Oz and other Narcissists: Coping with the One-Way Relationship in Work, Love, and Family

Lindsay Gibson's Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, or Self-Involved Parents

Elan Golomb's Trapped in the Mirror: Adult Children of Narcissists in the Struggle for Self

Susan Forward's Toxic Parents: Overcoming Their Hurtful Legacy and Reclaiming Your Life (a bit long in tooth now, but still useful) and Emotional Blackmail: When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation, and Guilt to Manipulate You

Kimberlee Roth & Frieda Friedman's Surviving a Borderline Parent: How to Heal Your Childhood Wounds & Build Trust, Boundaries, and Self-Esteem

(I've read -- actually deeply studied, using each as a workbook -- all of them, and feel comfortable recommending them.

Further, the dynamics of growing up in such families are strikingly similar to what happens in cults. If one is conditioned, socialized, habituated and normalized to a particular form of abuse (before one can recognize the abuse as such) in childhood, it is often the case that one will grow up to seek intimates who are likely to repeat the same form of traumatization to which they were normalized as children. In my case, I took my unconscious -- and unprocessed -- abuse into a series of cult and other co-dependent workplace and relationship situations. If one understands what happens in cults, one often gets a very clear picture of what happened in their own families of origin with narcissistic parents.

I was 27.

At that point both my parents were gone and all of my grandparents were gone and I didn't have anyone left to protect me from her and her flying monkeys. I finally put her on speaker, surreptitiously, so that my friend could hear the stuff she was saying. His response was that's fucked. From there I started looking for resources on how to deal with her. I found two books Children of the Self Absorbed by Nina Brown and Boundaries by Cloud and Townsend. That's the first time I saw the word abuse used to describe what she was doing. I knew from about 6 that there was something wrong with her and I lived with all of her shit without ever understanding what was going on.

Thank you for initiating a bibliography! My fav is
Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents.

I was able to break away from my parents after having a breakthrough from reading this book.

https://www.amazon.com/Children-Self-Absorbed-Grown-Ups-Getting-Narcissistic/dp/1572245611

You might find this book, or any about Narcissistic parents helpful:

Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents

https://www.amazon.com/dp/1572245611/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_bn6.zbY6HGKJS

I was reading one of the NPD books, and in it there was the suggestion to write down any experiences you could remember that you felt abused. I spent half a day doing that, bawling my eyes out. A few days later, I "somehow" managed to get a cold, I was sick for almost 2 weeks.

So, yeah, I can see what you're saying and you're right! I don't remember being told this, but I had the distinct impression that getting sick when I was a child was considered a sign of weakness. Lord knows nMom was never sick. I was rarely sick as a child that I can remember. At some point, I think I realised that she wasn't going to care, or take care of me, wasn't going to take the day off of work (this was the 70's when there weren't things like personal days or flex time) to look after me, so I think I just gave up, there wasn't any point to being sick. Also, unless I literally coughed out a lung, I was going to school, so there's that.

> allied health, for the craptastic nothingness...

Craptastic, maybe. Unglamorous, certainly. But "nothingness" I gotta take issue with. Real human needs you're fulfilling there. Somehow it reminds me of the Buddhist saying: "Before Enlightenment, chop wood, carry water. After Enlightenment, chop wood, carry water." Or the 21st century equivalents thereof :-)

> I wondered why, over the decades, no one ever called or sought me out to see how I'm doing. I realize that what I considered "significantly intimate" was actually not much of anything to others....

Welcome to my world. Except I finally found the right therapist when I was about 25.

My friend whose mother was a pathological narcissist highly recommends this book, btw.

I remember running into someone who was in my program in university (the first time), after 20 years or so. He confessed to me that he used to be fascinated to watch me in class and in the common rooms, and he said it was amazing how the others mostly found me invisible and inaudible. He said it was obvious to him that I was desperate to simply be part of the group, but I just had no idea how. So I asked him why he didn't try to help or even say anything to me at the time and he replied, sadly: "It's only obvious to me now. Back then I just thought you were a freak."

Sorry to hear this.

So in essence, you want:

1. To separate yourself and your mother from your father as soon as possible
   
2. To have minimum, ideally zero, contact with your father as long as possible
   
3. To take care of yourself and your mother as soon as you are able to
   
   Like what a lot of people had mention, you should check out AWAM, and that could help solve your first two problems. The third is tricky, but I think AWAM would have enough cases similar to yours, that they would have the right advice for you.
   
   Just a question, I understand that you have no car, but are you and your mother able to leave the house? Just wondering if you're locked up and unable to leave the house.
   
   The first three problems are technical problems, but there's also a fourth, longer term, problem that you should be aware about: living in a such a toxic environment brings subtle but powerful changes to the victims, especially to growing teenagers such as yourself. Do check out r/raisedbynarcissists. It's a subreddit for people who have toxic parents and perhaps you can learn more about your situation. You can also read Children of the Self-Absorbed by Nina Brown. Although it's written for adults that have not-so-abusive-but-still-toxic parents, I think this book will still be helpful to you. It shed light to the kind of parents I have, and provided steps that I can take to help me grow as a person. It's not a great book, but it was a necessary one. If you want the book, just let me know and I can send you a digital copy.
   
   For a sixteen year old, you have shown guts. But sometimes it's difficult to deal with this alone. I know I'm just an internet stranger, but if you ever need someone to talk to, about anything, just shoot me a message. You can keep your anonymity too obviously.
   
   Take care.

Just wanted to reach out and say you're not alone. I've been in the same situation since what feels like early childhood. Even once the fog lifted and I escaped my family of origin, I was still trapped in the same behavioral patterns I'd been taught, and so still attracting narcs; looking back at past friendships has been equally eye-opening and appalling. Working hard on myself atm via therapy and education to figure out how to stop this pattern - it's gotten easier, but I think it will always be a work in progress. Two things which helped the most so far:

1. Learning not to ignore my own gut feelings telling me that something's off, and this person's actions don't match whatever they're claiming about themselves. Being rbn, we're taught literally from birth to doubt ourselves and accept manipulative and even abusive behavior and mindsets as if they were normal - and all so that our nparents' delusions could always be reinforced, and their behavior always excused; so their ego is always gratified, and they're never held accountable for their own actions. (For a lot of us, in fact, we were taught to believe their behavior was our fault, and their problems were our job to fix even as children, so we learned to always blame ourselves instead of placing the responsibility where it belonged.) But those gut feelings exist for a very good reason - even if we can't put the why of them into words, or even quite make sense of them to ourselves just yet, your gut is your most valuable early warning system. Respect it; it's trying to help. It's always a signal for us to step back, think critically, and ask some difficult questions.
   
   and
   
   
2. I had to learn to stop automatically blaming myself for being "so stupid" or "so spineless" or even "deserving" poor treatment; this is related to the above in re: accepting responsibility for others' behavior. Yes, we do need to be more assertive in protecting our boundaries - but everyone is solely accountable for their own choices, including narcs: you can't "make" anyone abuse you. That was always their own decision, it was never okay no matter what "reason" they gave, and we shouldn't accept the blame for their actions or feel guilty for "letting them" hurt us.
   
   There have been a lot of resources I've found which have also helped me immensely, so at the risk of being spammy, here are some links:
   
   Out of the Fog: https://outofthefog.website/ (understanding the common behaviors in abusive personality disorders and staying sane despite them)
   
   Issendai's Down the Rabbithole: http://www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/ (understanding the dynamic of abusive parents and adult children, and why escaping them is not only justified but often the only way to heal)
   
   Pete Walker: http://pete-walker.com/pdf/flashbackManagement.pdf (the symptoms of C-PTSD and strategies for managing them)
   
   The Karpman Drama Triangle: https://lindagraham-mft.net/triangle-victim-rescuer-persecutor-get/ (the dynamics of the abuse cycle and how it often determines the 'role' we play in it)
   
   and two books:
   
   Gavin de Becker's The Gift of Fear: https://www.amazon.com/Gift-Fear-Survival-Signals-Violence/dp/0440226198
   
   Nina W. Brown's Children of the Self-Absorbed: https://www.amazon.com/Children-Self-Absorbed-Grown-Ups-Getting-Narcissistic/dp/1572245611
   
   As for the situation you outline here with this 'friend' and their texts? This is absolutely an attempt to manipulate you into feeling guilty, and so 'obligate' you to placate them - thereby feeding their ego. It's gross and inexcusable behavior, and I'm sorry it's a thing you were even exposed to, let alone have to deal with.
   
   Here's the good news, though: you don't owe this person anything. Literally nothing. They can shriek their entitled bullshit to the sky until they're blue in the face, and cry their little hearts out over what a victim they think they are for the rest of their lives, and it will change absolutely nothing about the fact that you are not responsible for fixing either their life or their emotions. Period, full stop, end of - and anyone who genuinely valued you as a person and any friendship you've built wouldn't try to treat it like some kind of leverage in order to force you to behave in a way that suits them. Normal, healthy humans don't view relationships as transactional, and they don't treat other people like vending machines, video game NPCs, or any other object that only exists to serve their needs and is obligated to give them whatever they want as long as they press certain buttons. Love is not ownership. Respect is not currency.
   
   So just keep doing what you're doing. Ignore them. Once they see that they're not getting the attention and soothing they're demanding, they'll move on to another source of supply - because that's all they've ever cared about in the first place. While you, knowing what they really are, can sever ties completely and spend your time with (not on - and certainly not for) people who aren't so broken that they believe they're entitled to abuse others in order to make themselves feel "loved enough".
   
   All best wishes to you. Stay strong. You deserve a life free from abuse, and filled with all the love, health, and happiness which should have always been yours. Hugs if you want them, and much <3.

Children of The Self Absorbed.

I’m not OP, but this book was hugely important to my healing: here

Make sure you have a therapist you trust before you read it, because it is going to bring up a lot of stuff that you’ll want to have professional help unpacking.

Its difficult to diagnose over the internet. Try reading this book, they have multiple quizes in it
http://www.amazon.com/Children-Self-Absorbed-Grown-Ups-Getting-Narcissistic/dp/1572245611

to help figure it out.

I have a shelf full, but here are some winners for BPD:

Toxic Parents

Mothers Who Can't Love
Emotionally Absent Mother

Will I Ever Be Good Enough

Drama of the Gifted Child

Children of the Self-Absorbed

Well there really isn't much else that can help... There might be some self help books, which you could send, but it's a bit specific what's needed and you're one step away from the person needing the help, so there's some distortion of course.

Something like this might be it

Or else this

Or else (a little less severe) this

Again, I'm jumping a bit to conclusions here and using the most likely scenarios, which could be horrible off the mark. And it assumes your friend wants to help themselves, which isn't a given either. Some people enjoy being miserable.

Have you been reading any self help books to help you while waiting for therapy? I found the following immensely helpful but I have to admit that I had to be exercising (usually hiking) while listening to the audiobooks to work out the feelings of all the trauma and old wounds it brought up. But the release was extremely cathartic and the validation of the authors is also healing. If you read, make sure you are in a quiet, calm and safe place. If you listen, a long walk will ease reflection.

https://www.amazon.com/Will-Ever-Good-Enough-Narcissistic/dp/1439129436

https://www.amazon.com/Children-Self-Absorbed-Grown-Ups-Getting-Narcissistic/dp/1572245611

Self-sabotage is deeply imbedded in our self-esteem, caused by the years of abuse and neglect of our emotional wellbeing. Ergo we don't deserve happiness. Utterly illogical, isn't it?

My self-sabotage comes in waves, sometimes overwhelming and other times just quietly lapping. It's worse when I have experienced a trigger or a stressor, and I have to work really hard to self-care. Mindful meditation, exercise and nutritious food help me.

Try to be kind to yourself and reach out whenever you need to. We're all here to heal.

Apparently there are two?

As the child of a borderline, the book stop walking on eggshells and a counselor reeeally helped me. No doubt you’ve experienced enough drama to know you are tough as nails, and not the one at fault! Growing up is hard enough. But you have a parent who has an untreated and unmanaged mental illness that even grown adults would walk away from. Of course he’ll project and call you crazy, that’s because projection is a form of his denial. Unfortunately if you attempt to control your image, and stop their smear campaign, they’ll be sure to manipulate enough that it seems to prove their point. Give it up, and keep your head up. You prove who you are by your actions and demeanor and they lose ammunition. Anyone worth their salt will see though it, and those who cannot are not people worthy of your time. At your age some people won’t get that it’s like growing up in an emotional warzone and really unless someone else experienced a similar nightmare, they aren’t going to understand the zero respect for boundaries and repeated abuse, neglect and emotional manipulation you endure. The moment you leave an abuser is when they act out, in attempt to regain control, but the boundary you placed by removing yourself from their attempts to incite a response deserves major applause! It’s the biggest step towards reclaiming your right to live that you could ever take, and know that there are many adults who still haven’t decided to take that leap due to overwhelming shame or fear of worse outcomes, or out of a repeated desire to please the parent and receive love. You don’t have to fix anyone to receive love, and you don’t have to walk on eggshells, or jump through hoops to receive love. You just accept love, and place boundaries with those who cross over your own. The children of narcissists and borderlines will also experiences disenfranchised grief. Connecting with a good counselor to help with coming through PTSD and learning how to establish boundaries, and know you have worth is pivotal to living a happy and healthy life as an adult. It saved my life! I chose at 15 to live with a woman and help clean her house/babysit her child to stay away from my toxic mother, so I could focus on passing school. Family and friends really didn’t get why, but guess what? That’s because they don’t know that it isn’t just regular teenager/parent tribulations and angst. You are not nuts, you’re exhausted for understandable reasons.

This book may really help.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/1572245611?tag=s7621-20

Or these too
https://www.lifehack.org/articles/communication/10-powerful-books-that-can-teach-you-how-deal-with-narcissists.html

I empathize with you as another daughter of a narcissist, who failed spectacularly out of therapy while refusing all accountability. (My mother, not me, I spent many years in therapy learning appropriate emotional coping strategies.)

These books, along with writing quite a bit of my story, were critical in my recovery:

Children of the Self Absorbed

Will I Ever Be Good Enough?


I highly recommend writing your life story, btw. After all the gas lighting abusers do, it is so validating to write and reread life from your own perspective.

And honestly - if you want therapy, try it! But don't feel like you have to limit yourself to one kind of therapy (talk) to recover. Many people find art, music, dance, yoga, and other activities of personal expression to be healing as well. Good luck on your taper!

Perhaps this will help?

https://www.amazon.com/Children-Self-Absorbed-Grown-Ups-Getting-Narcissistic/dp/1572245611

Sorry it's not so clear but great that you're aware of things though. There certainly is a lot of information around these days to help.
A couple good books that I stumbled on:
https://www.amazon.com/Trapped-Mirror-Children-Narcissists-Struggle/dp/0688140718

https://www.amazon.com/Children-Self-Absorbed-Grown-Ups-Getting-Narcissistic/dp/1572245611

I found both of those at the local library too so might just do that. (There are others as well and probably mentioned on this reddit somewhere, but those are not a bad start)

Yes. Borderline Personality Disorder mother and a Narcissiric Personality Disorder (though this diagnosis is rarely given because narcissists rarely seek therapy unless they are forced to or suffer a flash of light live-changing usually traumatic experience where their narcissism no longer can protect their false dreamt-up reality using others as ‘narcissistic supply’)

My parents sandwiched me growing up with their V-spot BPD-NPD real-self dance when they inadvertently and advertenly activate each others’ false selfs and defense mechanism who are unable to procure true real romantic intimacy to support an authentic true-self loving household therefore inflicting role-reversal enmeshed narcissistic abuse onto their self-esteem identity/indivislity developing children.

https://www.verywellmind.com/understanding-romantic-bpd-relationships-425217

https://www.amazon.com/Malignant-Self-Love-Narcissism-Sam-Vaknin/dp/8023833847

https://openlibrary.org/books/OL7270096M/Search_For_The_Real_Self

Which is why hordes of internet schizoid-like Internet-type dudes are trying to resolve their fundamental core inability to expresss true genuine feelings of true intimacy with friends, relationships, others, etc. because of a ‘beta’ father and an ‘abusive’ mother in a dysfunctionla nuclesr family structure, if at all. And we live in an escapist dreamworld trying to live vicariously through Hollywood superheroes to imitate — or for the Asian community an idealized person to guide and relate to; the idealized Asian father figure to sooth and ameliorate our lack of identity, self-esteem development, and masculinity.

Luckily for me, my father was masculine so I have no problems standing on my own two feet with dudes of all backgrounds (hustlers, ex-cons, and blue-collar, nerds, etc.) but the romantic part is very difficult for me right now because of an emotionally toxic mother with no immediate female relatives to relate to as a child. This is why long-term insight-oriented psycho dynamic talk therapy is critical to address the identity issues and garner a stable self-image and develop healthy self-esteem building in a ‘safe-space’ private dedicated session with an if good objective psychoanalytic psychoanalyst/psychotherapist. But HMOs/insurance/self-pay don’t want to pay for this only to cheap out with superfiscal cognitive-behavioral “jussss change ur thoughts about the ordeal” approach, rather than bringing about unresolved unconscious intrapsychic conflicts from (early) childhoods that arrests our core identity development/self-esteem building (confidence) as individuals in this “I”-centered Westernsphere whereas conversely Confucianism culture of asserting direct confrontation of “I” or “you’re xyz” is vehemently disrespectful in the interpersonal culture of indirection.

...but Confucianism/Buddhism teaches us we must embrace suffering and self/sacrifice for a better successive generation tomorrow. Our immigrant parents bring this collectivism mindset but to navigate American life, we must assert ourselves as independent functioning individuals with self-stability and self-constancy of who we are. Simply said, the West values the individual irrespective of the family despite the aristocratic lineage rhetoric as Hollywood always admires a great rags-to-riches underdog movie. Whereas the Confucianism East desires to maintain peace, harmony, order and peaceful resistance of nonconfrontation.

However, the irony is that growing up in the Anglosphere we have to garner a dialetically diametrically opposed dualistic strategy of collectivist Confucianism at home and individualist identity in the non-Asian real-world. The village community doesn’t respect the individual because you’re deviating from the social norm and ingroup clique and their collectively shared self-esteem and group identity. Whereas the West cherishes the Johnny Appleseed wanderer, Lewis and Clark expeditions, the visionary dreamer for whatever xyz dreamt-up upotia. The East wants to maintain the Confucius scholar-beaurcrat hierarchy. Essentially, America’s narrative is to explore and find family and a sense of community as an individual leaving home, whereas the East wrt to China desires to maintain internal social stability our 5000 Han Chinese homogenous familial hierarchical family. And it is no mistake that the Asian-to-Asian connection is vehemently ingrained into our inner concious fabric through generations of solidarity until our ancestors lost out our internal familial peace where the Qing dynasty failed his people to the West/Japan with the Century of Humiliation.

Western religious history and narrative is one fraught with master-slave savior-savee god and his followers and competing interpretations of the biblical texts therefore causing seemingly intergenerationally perpetual Holy War conflicts, aggresive exploitation of religious enemies, and war to conquest others to occupy religious superiority and “englightrnment” to them through pillaging villages and indoctrinating the “superior” religion into others through newly erected religious institutions. ....Confucianism has none of that. Heck, Buddha respects his followers worshipping of other Gods. Though the other religions respect you for worshipping other Gods is of their own issue.

Additionally Confucianism culture teaches us to not seek for extraneous help for fear of looking weak (maintaining ‘perception amnagement’ just like we curate our happy social-media happy moment reel to manipulate a certain image in the shared 3rd digital/cyberspace dimensional realities) and keep family matters private as to not air-out dirty laundry in order to ‘save face’ and not being shame to the family name — as in defeat and loss of status. But the crux of the matter is that the family systems dynamic is vehemently unhealthy due to intergenerational trauma and familial tug-of-war narcissism, especially given that immigrant parents self-sacrifice to economically bust their butts but along cling onto their children for emotional security in this new foreign world as we try to forge our own narratives and identity. The more we grow to be American with individuality,the more it counteracts the intergenerational Confucianism familial planning in the name of maintaining the preservation the lineage successive dynastic ‘family name’. (Indians are in the extreme with arranged marriages) Luckily for me my parents despite their narcissism are open-minded cosmopolitan individuals and don’t mind me Americanizing and imposed any racial dating restrictions.

The Narcissistic Family: Diagnosis and Treatment https://www.amazon.com/dp/0787908703/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_rA1-AbZS1J063

Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, or Self-Involved Parents https://www.amazon.com/dp/1626251703/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_dB1-AbVQXAZTN

Will I Ever Be Good Enough?: Healing the Daughters of Narcissistic Mothers https://www.amazon.com/dp/1439129436/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_NB1-AbN0P827E

Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents https://www.amazon.com/dp/1572245611/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_ND1-Ab94P47XX

As someone in the same boat, I totally recommend this book:

http://www.amazon.com/Children-Self-Absorbed-Grown-Ups-Getting-Narcissistic/dp/1572245611

So helpful oh my god.

I agree with rapunzel1111 - record if you can, and get used to keeping detailed notes regarding who said what. I have been to several counselors who didn't believe in narcissistic personality disorders (NPD) and proceeded to blame me for the issues in my relationship with Nrents. If you have the ability to select a counselor you want, look for ones that have experience with N-personalities, N-related disorders, or even do an initial meet-and-greet to discover if they have ever counseled anyone else who was victimized by a narcissist (this will also indicate whether or not they believe NPDs exist). Some counselors who are far away are open to Skype or phone sessions.

It's important to recognize that many health professionals don't want to weigh in too early, and many N victims can present issues of their own which may or may not be the same as the N. It's also the difference (at least in the US) between some counselors and actual mental health professionals - professionals (especially those employed by the government) can only make decisions based on behavior they have actually witnessed. We have gone through this with a family member who will act normal when a professional is present.

Anger is a natural reaction to many situations, so start by acknowledging it and allowing yourself to be angry (essentially self-validation). Say, "I'm angry about x. It's ok for me to be angry about x." Be angry, but try to move it in a positive direction by determining why you're angry and what can be done to alter/fix/avoid the same trigger in the future. It's also natural to go through periods of anger as you remember abusive things/actions/situations and process through them.

It's possible to become what you hate, so I would encourage you to not allow anger to simmer or grow into rage. If you haven't already, try journaling as well to help clear your head and ensure you are moving towards healing.

These books are good starting points to help you work through how to best love and forgive yourself while separating from toxic and/or Nrents:

Emotional Blackmail: When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation, and Guilt to Manipulate You

Toxic Parents: Overcoming Their Hurtful Legacy and Reclaiming Your Life

Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents

You'll cycle through periods of grief as you process. That's normal. It's also a good time to learn to be nice to yourself.

Once I was out of easy reach (read: more than 50 miles) away from my Mother, she stopped calling/texting/emailing/sending birthday or anniversary cards and presents. She expected me to do all the emotional work to keep the relationship together. When I stopped doing that, it was shocking just how fast she acted like I didn't exist - but she's the first to say just how happy she is to hear from me when I call and just how much I mean to her (uh... sure).

For me, I found comfort in knowing that my parents loved me as much as they were probably able to. They couldn't/didn't love me enough to meet my needs, they are just people (meaning everyone's flawed in their own ways), and there's nothing I can do about that besides move on and look for love and support from other (normal and emotionally mature) people.

I got a LOT out of these books and maybe they will help you as you start to heal:

By Susan Forward

• Emotional Blackmail: When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation, and Guilt to Manipulate You
  
  
• Mothers Who Can't Love
  
  
• Toxic Parents: Overcoming Their Hurtful Legacy and Reclaiming Your Life
  
  
  By Lindsay C. Gibson - Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents
  
  By Nina W Brown - Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown Up's Guide to Getting OVer Narcissistic Parents

Sorry— forgot link. https://www.amazon.com/Children-Self-Absorbed-Grown-Ups-Getting-Narcissistic/dp/1572245611/ref=asc_df_1572245611/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=312049124368&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=9958398960446952332&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9013531&hvtargid=pla-435121209069&psc=1&tag=&ref=&adgrpid=61851652213&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvadid=312049124368&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=9958398960446952332&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9013531&hvtargid=pla-435121209069