Reddit reviews Cognitive Therapy of Personality Disorders, Second Edition

Thanks for that thoughtful reply!

I love how your first paragraph demonstrates exactly the kind of response that would "catch narcissists like honey": Open flattery ("Wow. You about nailed me perfectly.") followed by insight of your own demonstrating that you are a worthy subordinate. Where do you live; I want you in my life! ;)

> Was there some part of you that wanted to change, or was it really all pressure from your boyfriend? The standard wisdom about change these days seems to be that you can't influence anyone else to change if they're not already doing it for themselves.

The literature (e.g. Cognitive Therapy of Personality Disorders, Overcoming Resistant Personality Disorders, Identifying and Understanding the Narcissistic Personality, etc.) says that narcissists will deny that anything is wrong with us and aggressively resist changing until we have either dug ourselves into a hole too deep for us to get out of (which induces narcissistic depression) or a valued partner threatens to leave if we do not change. These are the two reasons narcissists may decide to enter therapy.

In therapy we are challenging patients, and we frequently terminate therapy before any progress has been made. However, if our defenses do get broken down, from that point on we are more open to "reconstruction" than e.g. avoidant patients. Once we learn to be vulnerable and have the experience that just because we are flawed it does not mean that we are absolutely worthless, we are tremendously relieved (narcissists carry quite a burden, you know) and then we start to realize how increased self-awareness benefits us. From that point on we start to be more self-motivated and cooperative.

In my case it took more than a year from the time my SO first started to take issue with my behavior to when I first made an appointment with a therapist. The first one was awful and I never went back, but I had 13 sessions with the second one I found. She helped me realize just how unaware I was of my emotions, which was eye-opening, but eventually I manipulated her into thinking my problems were caused by my SO. When I realized what had happened, I abruptly terminated therapy. Then I tried two more therapists neither of whom understood me, I felt, and for a while I gave up on therapy, thinking I was too complex for anyone to be able to help me. However, I became desperate to learn to be good enough to my SO that he wouldn't leave me, so eventually I wormed my way into a treatment program for personality disorders. There I finally I got a therapist who knew how to see through me and handle me. She was closer in age to my mother than to me and it was incredibly effective to have her behave toward me the way a good mother would have done - affectionately helping me to identify and cope with my own emotions and also getting appropriately angry with me when I made her feel bad. It was like getting a second chance at being raised right.

Aaaaanyway, my point is that it took A LOT of time, tears and therapy (and also meditation) before my defenses were broken down and a humbler, more secure and more empathic self was nurtured. I've been incredibly lucky in how my SO has simultaneously pushed and supported me and also in the chemistry I had with my last therapist, and no way in hell I would've come this far without all that help. The odds of other narcissists being that lucky are not good.

I don't kid myself that I'm "cured". I think I will always feel irrationally entitled. In particular I struggle with the self-discipline to work hard and carry my own weight, because I can't seem to shake the notion that things ought to be easy for me. When my SO and I argue these days, it is usually either because I have not completed a task that we had agreed I should do (we work together part-time on our own business) or because he feels I am insufficiently empathetic with him/not making enough of an effort to be there for him emotionally - and I have to agree that I don't push myself as hard as I should. My life circumstances are currently good enough that I don't have to struggle too much, but I intend to remain childless because I do not think I have it in me to sacrifice my own needs. (My SO does not want children either so we're on the same page.) But I do feel like a changed person with a genuine humility and a sense of conscience that I did not have before. I don't look down on others the way I used to and I don't exploit others even when I can get away with it because now that I actually look myself in the mirror, metaphorically speaking, I want to be able to respect myself.

On that note, I probably should get back to the work I'm currently procrastinating on........ ;)

Edit: Forgot to ask what you think the payoff is for you in hanging out with narcissists? You seem aware of how it's bad for you, but there must be something you get out of it. You mention that you feel cool for being the only one to understand them and also that you tend to blend into the scenery. Do narcissists recognize something in you that others don't, or what do you think is the attraction for you?

When you have someone whose core problematic set of cognitions revolve around how they are amazing and better than most people, it's hard to convince that person they need therapy to improve themselves ;)

In terms of most likely therapy, this is a good template - https://www.amazon.com/Cognitive-Therapy-Personality-Disorders-Second/dp/1593854765