Reddit reviews The Suit: A Machiavellian Approach to Men's Style
We found 8 Reddit comments about The Suit: A Machiavellian Approach to Men's Style. Here are the top ones, ranked by their Reddit score.
HarperCollins Publishers
Excellent, let me nerd out for a second about suits. Also, that documentary is a GREAT starting point. Personally, it makes me want to become a tailor, and it makes me sad that tailoring is becoming a dying breed of old people who have no younger people to take up their mantle.
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So, before you get into the process of suit making and all of that, and the art that is tailoring. I encourage you to read up on what makes a suit, a suit. But, I'll cut it down real simply for you and leave some links so that you can read up on in depth if it suits you (hodor).
Let's start with the most basic question. What is the foundation of the suit? Strangely, the foundation of the suit, is the shoulder. The drape of your suit and the cut of your suit starts from the shoulder and moves downward. So like we always say, if it doesn't fit on the shoulder, put it back on the rack. There are tons of different types of cuts for shoulders, and how it's padding, and how the sleeve is attached to the shoulder that is all unique to each cut, although it is becoming more homogenized (Personally, I'm an italian cut kinda guy, Neapolitan in specific). How do you like your shoulders? Straight across? Narrower? No padding at all? Extreme sloping? These are the questions you should consider when bespoking your suit, or purchasing your suit in general. How do you like your shoulder to sing?
Next, lets move onto the beauty that is the lapel roll, the flower of the suit, the thing that blooms, the detail that gives your suit depth. A detail that simply resonates with the rest of your suit, don't be flat (jos. a bank), the lapel roll is a piece of art of itself, and a good dry cleaner will not press the life out of the lapel. Of course, you could just do it yourself.
So now that we have touched the outside of the suit. Let's dig a little deeper, how about the inside of the suit? Perhaps as important as the shoulder, is your canvassing. Why is it important? Because canvas is what gives your suit a shape, it's the thing that slowly molds to your body, a quality suit will slowly mold to your body and drape better and better with each wear. A suit with the proper insides need's no hanger to give it shape (put it on a hanger). It almost wears itself (ignore the fact that they are trying to sell something).
Here is some more reading on canvassing
In closing, how about some master tailors talking about their art?
Rudolph Popradi
Martin Greenfield
Multiple tailors from naples discuss their life of tailoring
And now, some books.
A menswear book, a little more for the older gents and those more intersted in history. But very much a classic book that is highly praised for being all encompassing.
How about a book that teaches you to make your own garments?
And a machiavallian approach to the suit. Maybe not as highly praised, but more reading can't hurt that much.
Let's ask some people about their thoughts on the suit and it's changes through the years.
1, 2, 3, 4.
And let's touch on the tuxedo for a bit, probably a little pretentious (especially that esquire guy), but for some reason I like watching people dress up while giving their thoughts..
And finally, a series of videos on a class about suit construction (mainly for women).
Probably doesn't entirely answer your questions, but hey, suits are awesome. If I had enough money to wear a suit everyday for every situation (james bond) I would. If you have the opportunity to apprentice under a tailor, I highly suggest it, maybe you won't become a master tailor, and you most likely will not get paid, but it would be an awesome experience to be under a master craftsman.
For young people, certain things just look like you’re trying too damn hard: bowties, pocket squares, French cuffs, white collars on a colored shirt, suspenders, wide-spread collars, vested suit (sometimes), etc.
It’s easy to blame other people, but your clothes are prompting their reaction. I don’t know you and I don’t know the way you dress. But perhaps you should think about trying to be more subtle: buying nice clothes that aren’t at all ostentatious. Don’t wear bowties if, when you wear one, people make comments.
In my opinion, the majority of advice on MFA will make a high school or college students look good for other high school or college students. If I wore my pants below my natural waste or if I wore wingtips or a bow tie, the men at my work would think I was an immature, insecure, hipster douche bag. There is nothing wrong with those things, but dress to your audience. Being stylish, being able to express your own, personal style, within the bounds of what’s acceptable to your peers is a true and worthy challenge. An artist is limited by the artistic media he chooses to work with. So to, you are limited by your lifestyle, income, peer group, profession, region, etc. Strive to be stylish and express yourself within you lifestyle’s bounds. Then you will look good without looking like you’re wearing a costume to try to look good.
If following the advice on this forum is getting criticism, I’d like to suggest some alternative sources for advice:
http://www.amazon.com/Dressing-Man-Mastering-Permanent-Fashion/dp/0060191449/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1344004043&sr=8-1&keywords=allan+flusser
http://www.amazon.com/Clothes-Man-Principles-Fine-Dress/dp/0394546237/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1344004043&sr=8-2&keywords=allan+flusser
http://www.amazon.com/GENTLEMAN-TIMELESS-GUIDE-FASHION-Ullmann/dp/3833152702/ref=pd_bxgy_b_img_b
http://www.amazon.com/The-Suit-Machiavellian-Approach-Style/dp/0060891866/ref=pd_sim_b_7 (especially the chapter for “young” persons)
http://www.amazon.com/Elegance-Menswear-G-Bruce-Boyer/dp/0393304388/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1344004086&sr=1-1&keywords=bruce+boyer
http://www.amazon.com/Eminently-Suitable-G-Bruce-Boyer/dp/0393028771/ref=sr_1_3?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1344004086&sr=1-3&keywords=bruce+boyer
Your library should have these, as they are menswear “classics.” The books are well-written and, though older than something like “Esquire The Handbook of Style,” the advice is better. How to dress well is a timeless art.
5'7" here. I've read a lot of these guides over the years, and this is easily one of the best. Well done.
On suits, I'm going to have to disagree with this:
> Unlike most people, you don’t want your suit jacket to cover your rear completely.
This works for short and slim (and young), but if you've got some, erm, shape to your rear, you'll want to cover it. Cropped jackets also won't fly in most workplaces that require suits.
I've actually been thinking about this a lot lately, and I think a better guide is something like this:
> Jackets should be just long enough to fall straight.
There's probably a better way to word it, but basically, you want the jacket to not flare out at the bottom.
I've also dug into the oft-repeated "rule" about short guys not wearing double-breasted suit jackets, and after going back to sources like The Suit, I've found there's an exception: unless you can have it custom-made.
Couple examples of short guys in double-breasted suits: 1 2
Casual:
Jeans: Jacob Cohen
Shirts: Emmanuel Berg, Hugo Boss
Blazers: Paul Smith, Hugo Boss
Sweaters: Emmanuel Berg (cashmere), Ralph Lauren (merino)
Pants: Hugo Boss
Jackets: Joop, Hugo Boss, Barbour, Burberry
Shoes: crocket & jones
Office/Work:
Shirts: Emmanuel Berg, Hugo Boss, but considering bespoke options
Blazers: Paul Smith, Hugo Boss
Suits: Corneliani M2M, but considering bespoke options
Pants: Hugo Boss
Coats: Joop, Burberry
Shoes: Crocket & Jones, Hugo Boss
Other stuff, like ties (rarely use them), or handkerchiefs, pretty much anything good, emmanuel berg, armani, boss, hermes.
cuff links: anything good.
Hair style: Fairly short, but with an old school cut (think Gatsby).
Note: I am 40,in decent physical shape, and due to the nature of my work, dressing well is kind of a requirement (consulting), so this looks natural on me. Oh, and live in Europe.
Edit:
I should perhaps add that I actually like male fashion in a timeless sense, and take a very hard look at the look I want to achieve (timelessness, natual, refined). For any man who wants to take their wardrobe to the "next level", I'd strongly recommend two books:
http://www.amazon.com/Dressing-Man-Mastering-Permanent-Fashion/dp/0060191449
and
http://www.amazon.com/The-Suit-Machiavellian-Approach-Style/dp/0060891866
They will both give you the basics of suits, materials, etc, with references to old-school male icons... think mad men on steroids... in the style department...
but never forget, style without substance is worthless.. fashion/style is not necessarily "peacocking", but it does help in attraction of course ;)
Well, the person I quoted--who explained that black is traditionally considered an inappropriate color for suits--is the author of The Suit: A Machiavellian Approach to Men's Style, which has been reviewed by the WSJ (where he has also been published), and he has also been interviewed by Forbes. As far as internet strangers go, he's a pretty authoritative one.
Ultimately, it's like any other "rule" or tradition. You can wear a suit jacket with a center vent, a tuxedo with notch lapels, or french cuffs without a jacket. I'm sure there are people who would find no problem with these things--including wearing a black suit. But as Manton said, "it is still against the rules." The fact that you've observed many people wearing black suits--even (perhaps especially) adults--is not surprising. This is a very common menswear misconception. But that doesn't mean that they're not still flouting tradition and committing a fashion faux pas. Many people wear square-toed shoes. I bet your career center wouldn't stop you at the door if you wore them to a job fair. That doesn't mean that they are appropriate as a matter of tradition or the "rules" of menswear. Same thing for brightly-colored matching vests at weddings.
With respect to your career center's advice, their goal is to make sure that the students don't embarrass themselves or the school by showing up to a career fair in seersucker (apologies if you're south of the Mason Dixon line). Unlike that robin's egg blue tux lurking in the back of the closet, a black suit won't offend anyone or get you dinged during an interview (unless your interviewer is a sartorial enthusiast), and black is such a common choice for a first suit that of course a career center making a list of acceptable suit colors is going to approve that. That has nothing to do with whether black is a correct choice as a matter of tradition or fashion.
You mentioned you've never before heard of this convention. Like I said, neither had I when I was in college. But spend a little time looking into this topic, and you'll find that it's fairly widely known and generally agreed upon--as far as fashion "rules" go. Not to toot my own karma horn, but there's a reason my post got upvoted 100 times and the posts recommending that OP buy a black suit ended up getting buried. It's not that I'm the first person to say any of those things, but rather that the tips I gave him--including not to wear black--are based on the prevailing rules of good menswear.
>Yes, I'm sure Machiavelli is quoted all the time on Wall Street.
Probably by way of paraphrase, though:
Edit: Or even:
http://www.amazon.com/Suit-Machiavellian-Approach-Mens-Style/dp/0060891866
If you've ever been on SF you might be familiar with power user Manton. This is his book. It is pretty good. reads like an ego trip, but definitely provides a lot of insight into tailoring styles and techniques and suits in general. I would strongly suggest this book if you are better than everyone else.
Unless you're wearing shirts with very wide spread collars and long collar points, you should be fine. Some of the most conservative sources will say you should only wear button-down collars without a tie, but general consensus seems to be that any type of collar looks fine without a tie and with the top button undone, as long as it isn't so widely-spread so as to hang strangely.