(Part 2) Best central america history books according to redditors

How to read Mayan Hieroglyphs. Imagine: you're a 19th century Westerner. As far as you know, the jungles of Mexico are an empty waste, filled with terrible bugs and horrible climate (you're also probably racist, so not a whole lot of help there either). Then, well, you find this. Giant ancient temples, monuments, buried in the jungle for hundreds of years. How? Why? Sure, the Spanish recorded cities in the North of the Yucatan, but they were nothing like this. And you just keep finding more of them deep in the jungle, and most crazily they're covered in what is unmistakably... writing. Who were these ancient people, and what did they have to say?

Digging through the archives in Europe, the Western world found ancient books written by these same people, the few saved from Spanish fire. This was a whole literary culture, destroyed by the Spanish in their invasion. Think about how radically this changed our ideas about the world. Look, the fact that the ancient Hittites, the Assyrians, The Sumerians, the Minoans wrote, well that wasn't too unlikely, right? I mean, they were related to cultures we knew could write. Hell, there'd even been great success in figuring out Egyptian, Sumerian, Assyrian and several others. But, understanding this was going to be way harder.

Firstly, there was no translation, no rosetta stone. Well, not unless you counted a weird document made by a Spanish Monk in the 1500s, which most scholars at the time didn't. The sounds it suggested for each symbol didn't make sense when you applied them. Besides, scholars became increasingly convinced the ancient maya were peaceful priest-astronomers, whose symbols were not really like our (western) writing but something more primitive. Symbols, ideas, not a real script. Secondly, people thought for the above reason, that there was no living descendant of the language, certainly not the Maya of the native peoples. Oh, no definitely not.

Now, by the 1920s, scholars had figured out how to read their numbers, and found a fantastically complicated series of interlocking calendars, of astrological patterns. But, there wasn't any progress on the actual reading. In fact, there wasn't any until the 1950s from a very odd place.

Scene: Berlin 1945. Soviet Soldiers, entering the capital of the enemy fan out through the city to end the war. Our hero: Yuri Knorozov, an eccentric Soviet soldier, formerly studying Egyptology before the war. Now, the good story is that Knorozov entered the national library in Berlin as it was burning, and saw in a moment of happenstance a rare book containing copies of three extant Maya codices (folded books). Rushing, he saved it and read it through the return journey to Moscow. However, he later said that there was no fire, he simply picked up a box of books and found it. But still! This is a critical moment.

For Knorozov was a great admirer of the old decipherers, the men who had translated Egyptian, Hittite. Determined, he settled back in Moscow, and began to think. He had never been to Mayan lands (he wouldn't get to go until after the fall of the Berlin wall), but armed with books and thought, he made important progress. His major incite was this: the maya script was a rela script, probably composed of syllables, and that de Landa's notes (the Spanish Monk) was a garbled account of these syllables. In 1952 he published his early work, met with scorn in America. Yet he kept at it.

Now, Knorozov wasn't the only guy to be working on this, there many other important researchers, but this story is getting long. So to cut it short: With Knorozov's insights, he and many other researchers in the USA and Mexico began to translate the maya script. At first, just a little, then with each confirmation, a little more, until it was a great flood. Through 500 years of jungle and persecution, the ancient Maya were speaking to us.

About what? Well, at first it didn't appear that interesting. Here was not the earlier priest-astronomers. Kings being crowned, bloody wars, the founding of cities. Yet, slowly a complex tapestry revealed itself, of warring cities, great leaders, epic battles. What had seemed like distant figures became vicious death and life struggles for power. They weren't all that different from the politics around us (alright, more penis-stabbing, but hey).

So there: a great mystery solved. The Mayan script. A thousand years of civilization that we can now read (mostly).

Edit: I'm so glad my most popular comment is about history. If you want to know more, Michael D. Coe's The Maya is a great (if a bit dense) introduction. Coe's Breaking the Maya Code is a more focused text on just the script. For a shorter piece about breaking the code and other cases of script decipherement (Egyptian, Greek Linear B) and other unsolved scripts (Rongorongo, Etruscan, Greek Linear A) check out Robinson's Lost Languages: The Enigma of the World's Undeciphered Scripts, which is also a fantastically beautiful book (serious, if the typographer of this book and the graphic designer ever finds this post, please pat yourself on the back. Or something. You're awesome!).

Thanks Reddit Gold Guy Explains why thinks looked different.

Wow, this is such a selective piece of the story chosen for sensationalist reasons.

Diego de Landa did try to have all Mayan writing burned, though thankfully he missed a few books, and there are still all of the stone carvings. Later in life, however, he had a change of heart, and tried to preserve the writing system by having someone write down a Mayan alphabet.

Of course, he didn't understand that the Mayan writing system was logographic, along with syllabic characters, rather than alphabetic, so when he asked for a letter like "t", he would have for the syllable "te", since that's how he pronounced the letter in Spanish. Anyhow, this Mayan alphabet of his, along with the realization that the Mayan languages spoken today are actually closely related to classical Mayan, proved to be the key to deciphering the writing system eventually. So yes, the burning of the Mayan texts was atrocious, but he later did the best he could to try and preserve the writing system later. See Michael D. Coe's "Breaking the Mayan Code" for more information.

Also, besides Diego de Landa, religious missionaries have actually been some of the greatest proponents of minority languages and their preservation. James Evans, a British missionary in Canada, developed the a writing system for the Swampy Cree that was so successful, it ended up being adopted by most Aboriginal Canadian tribes, from the Athabaskans to the Inuit. The whole family of writing systems is now known as Canadian Aboriginal Syllabics.

More recently, the organization doing the most work on preserving minority languages is SIL International, a missionary organization dedicated to documenting and preserving minority and endangered languages.

Now, I'm not usually an ardent defender of religion, being an atheist myself, but I do respect the contributions that missionaries have made to preserving minority languages, and I feel that Bishop Diego de Landa is more the exception than the rule in this respect.

This is one of the reasons of why I dislike (note I haven't said hate) the US overall. I live in El Salvador (Central America) and still remember a lot of shit seen during the Civil War.

There were 2 sides and a lot of people say different things based on where they lived and the people they encountered. On my side the guerilla, the "bad guys" helped us evacuate because near our neighborhood they had intel that there were going to be bombing runs, I was 7 back then, I didn't understand the whole thing back then and for some reason wasn't that scared on several things I saw (I was too young to fully understand the danger that was around), all the ones we found, were helful, kind and took care of us, the goverment was providing too many benefits to the upper classes while the population were living with substandard salaries and shitty conditions, there are too many things involved but I don't want to end up writing a essay on this.

I remember that in front of my house they had beheaded someone and hung his head from a tree as a warning for all the ones that would trespass that area, and the goverment established a curfew, if you got caught after it, you'd get shot on sight.

A LOT of people were massacrated and a lot of the weapons and training that the goverment received was sponsored by the US. There is a book that was written by someone from the red cross I think read it quite a while ago, the name is "Por los caminos de Chalatenango: con la salud en la mochila"

http://www.amazon.com/Por-los-caminos-Chalatenango-Coleccion/dp/8484051196

Is a good read if you understand spanish and puts everything from the eyes of someone that was external to the entire conflict.

TLDR: US Intervention is global, they have done unspeakable things in other countries.

I think a great place to start would be "The Maya" by Michael Coe

and

"Mexico, from the Olmec to the Aztec" By Michael Coe and Rex Koontz.

Both are quite academic in nature though, so if you have trouble with academic writing they may not be the best choices, though they are certainly some of the best background books on Mesoamerica I have found.

Edit: Also, nitpicking, but that would be Maya, as Mayan is an adjective describing things (eg: Mayan Ceramics), and Maya is the name of the people. :)

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I've always found the core concepts found in Aztec religious thought and philosophy to be fascinating. A really great post, OP.

For those interested, here is an accessible, fairly inclusive introductory book that I own that covers not only religion and philosophy but also how those core beliefs applied practically to and shaped matters of war, trade, education, politics, and so on. It also includes splashes of Mayan thought, and touches on the pre-Aztec societies that were later incorporated into the Aztec Empire.

Watching: Snowed in this weekend so spent most of Saturday watching Ken Burns The Civil War documentary, which I've probably seen about eight times but learn something new each go around. It's amazing how close Lincoln was to not being reelected in 1864.

Reading: Just got a book my dad finished (reading not writing) called "1847: A Chronicle of Genius, Generosity & Savagery" I just started,

Listening: Nick Drake. Came across him on the 99% Invisible Podcast episode "Three Records from Sundown". He reminds me of Van Morrison, with a more delicate voice. He released three critically acclaimed records in the late 60s/early 70s that never saw commercial success, and committed suicide, only to develop a cult following after his death.I recommend giving him a listen.

All three pair well with a shitload of scotch.

So I've started writing my research paper for my International Relations class, and I'm doing it on the Zapatistas and their struggles with democratization. This book is probably going to serve as my biggest source. Does anyone else have any other sources I could use for the development of the rebellion and the autonomous communities in the past twenty years?

Como mencioné, es algo poco conocido, menos documentado.

En el libro "Breaking the Maya code" el Dr. Coe (un eminente Arqueólogo) menciona que durante sus viajes a Yucatán (en los años 60's) en Mérida, entre los "rojillos" podías encontrar bastantes libros de origen Ruso, y el compró varios de ellos precisamente por que en estados unidos era casi ilegal poseer algo así debido a la guerra fría. Esto me lo confirmó una persona que fue líder estudiantil

En mi caso, en el DF pude comprar (en la calle de Donceles) algunos libritos de cuentos rusos y chinos (como de los 50's) Si los lees con un poco de suspicacia, es fácil notar su intención evangelizadora.

Essential in what sense? Are you looking for a more scientific book or just a good fun read? if you are looking for the latter "A forest of Kings" is pretty good.
http://www.amazon.com/Forest-Kings-Untold-Story-Ancient/dp/0688112048

I'll always recommend Michael Coe's The Maya, which you can get super cheap on Amazon. In the meantime, you can check out the Flaired User Profiles for us Amercanists here, particularly myself, /u/Mictlantecuhtli, and /u/400-rabbits. We've each got a number of posts on the Maya you might find interesting.

Your Dad is being overly harsh, but he's not wrong. Simply put you shouldn't be using a video game as a source for any discussions you have with other people. It's fine as an inspiration but it is not a source of historical information.

These wouldn't be bad places to start and should be sources your Dad would be happy with.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Aztecs-Very-Short-Introduction-Introductions-ebook/dp/B005YMCCR8/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1487438218&sr=8-2&keywords=oxford+history+of+aztecs

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Ancient-Kingdoms-Mexico-Penguin-history/dp/0140135871/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1487438233&sr=8-1&keywords=penguin+history+of+aztecs

If you really are interested in this topic I'd recommend reading a few books on the war… Aside from the books mentioned by Jnalvrz, I think Las Mil y Una Historias de Radio Venceremos is an amazing book about the clandestine radio.

There is also La Terquedad del Izote which is a first hand account of the radio's years.

I know he mentioned La Masacre del Mozote and I can't stress enough how chilling this book is.

I have never read Las Carceles Clandestinas but know enough about the woman behind the book to know that she is a fighter.

I was too little at the time of the civil war to remember much, but I have such vivid memories of the Ofensiva del 89 (I was 5 at the time). My mom, sister and autistic uncle walked across Soyapango to get to my great-grandma's house. I remember walking in between a soldier and a guerrillero shooting at each other and stopping because we had our white flag (made from my little sister's school shirt). I remember my mom trying to cover our eyes and noses so we wouldn't see or smell the dead bodies. And even though she tried, I remember seeing a kid (he looked so young) picking up bodies and throwing them on a metal cart to take who knows where. I remember hearing the helicopters and not knowing what was gonna happen. I also remember both soldiers and guerrilleros knocking on our house and coming in, my mom offering them some cigarettes because we were running out of food and she didn't have much to give.

It was years before I could hear a helicopter and not be terrified. I can't even imagine what it would have been like if I was older, or a boy.


Ninja Edit: If you can, I recommend watching Voces Inocentes. It's the story of a boy who is about to turn 12, which is the age at which they were recruited for either the military or the guerrilla. It never fails to make me cry.

Ahhuatl's suggestions are great, and the Florentine Codex (especially Book 1) is pretty much your authoritative source. Leon-Portilla is another great resource and you may want to check out his Aztec Thought and Culture if you ever want a scholarly look at the philosophy of Aztec religion.

If you're looking for the myths themselves though, you may want to check out Taube and Miller's Illustrated Dictionary of the Gods and Symbols of Ancient Mexico and the Maya. It is a dictionary/encyclopedia though, so it may be kind of dry. Carrasco's Daily Life of the Aztecs doesn't directly tell the myths but does feature large passages on important rituals (and is just a good book overall).

here is the second one but they are all used

http://www.amazon.com/Nostalgia-guatemalteca-Guatemalan-Spanish/dp/9929801502/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1407803475&sr=1-1&keywords=nostalgia+guatemalteca

Unfinished Conquest by Victor Perera


The Battle for Guatemala by Susanne Jonas


Buried Secrets by Victoria Sanford


Guatemala: Never Again! by the REMHI Project


Silence on the Mountain: Stories of Terror, Betrayal, and Forgetting in Guatemala by Daniel Wilkninson

Shattered Hope By Piero Gleijeses. This is the best history of the "Decade of Spring" period of 1944-54, and corrects some of the mistakes in Bitter Fruit.

Gift of the Devil Jim Handy

You're in luck, there are entire books written about this very subject

Also Comanches by T.R. Fehrenbach also Lone Star by the same author for Texas specific settlement (first part of book). Also Fire and Blood: A History of Mexico by the same author again.

Wrong person and wrong language. The real commie machine behind Árbenz's policies were the product of [the communist party's leader] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jos%C3%A9_Manuel_Fortuny) which was part of Árbenz's cabinet and advisors, and in this book, the whole presidency of Árbenz is examined. And most of his policies and laws were strongly influenced by the cabinet. We also get to know how the government started to buy weapons from the Czechs, as a way to enter the commie sphere (because buying them from France, the US, or any other western country would be as effective, or better).

Here, we can see an example of the theory of Árbenz being a tool (without him noticing). But this was because the policies were mainly anti imperialist, and the socialist ones had been done in Arévalo's presidency. Árbenz was mainly a continuation of this, and his close relationship with Fortuny (as far as having him writing Árbenz speeches) was what made him more socialist than he really was (albeit not that much, if much, Luxemburgist).

And the same cabinet that influenced Árbenz's commie tendencies were the same that got the commie parties banned (Nicolás Brol, a wealthy landowner was the minister of agriculture; and Roberto Fanjul, a businessman and notable anti-commie took part of this, and to moderate the 900 decree to take the UFCO's land).


But all of this is kaput, because the USSR never, never contacted Árbenz, and then we can not exactly know how that would turn out.

TL;DR: The cabinet was behind all of the desitions made in the government, either commie or anti commie. Add a very flexible Árbenz that wanted to continue with social policies but feared the US more than anyone. ^it^^was ^^^a ^^^^conspiracy

Pd. most links are in spanish.

here you are! http://www.amazon.com/Forest-Kings-Untold-Story-Ancient/dp/0688112048

I'm reading "Lost City of the Monkey God" by Douglas Preston right now. It's been a highly entertaining first-hand account of (what I think was) the first use of LIDAR for archaeology in the jungles of Central America, and the ground exploration that followed. I'd definitely recommend it to anyone who's interested in this story.

https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B01G1K1RTA

Fire and Blood: A History of Mexico I have always found this historian to be very readable and good at overviews - he also has a book on Texas. Keep in mind that it was written in the 1970's, I believe. So his take on Native Americans may be some what dated.