(Part 2) Top products from r/Jung

I just wanted to add something that I felt would be fitting here. This is simply my perspective on the collective unconscious so take it as you will, but it seems relevant.

I see the collective unconscious as being a good basis for spiritual ideas, and I have my own beliefs based around it. The reason I see it as a good basis is 1.) much of it is empirically supported, and 2.) the idea of a collective unconscious itself to some extent implies a universal realm of existence.

First I would like to briefly cover relevant literature which substantiates the collective unconscious. The point of this is to show which aspects of this idea are supported enough to branch off of. The information I’m going to sum up is from the field of research called Affective Neuroscience, which was coined by Jakk Panksepp, who I believe is Jungian himself based on his reference to archetypes, and both Freud and Jung. I believe his book is a must read for all Jung enthusiasts and I’ll be linking it below. After this I’ll present my little theory of what this means from a spiritual perspective.

Summation of Relevant Literature

Affective Neuroscience is a field of study which combines three major disciplines of psychology: Cognitive, Behaviorial, and Neuroscience. What the study’s and experiments have generally shown is that there are distinct anatomical neural structures which illicit consistent patterns of behavior in animals when stimulated, and are shared to varying degrees by all species (the degree of variation becomes larger as species become farther apart on the phylogenetic tree, with the nervous system becoming more complex rostrally as it progresses through species). On top of this, due to the nature of the behavior patterns showing approach/avoidance tendencies, it’s reasonable to conclude that it is an emotional response which is evoked from stimulation that influences the corresponding pattern of behavior.

To simplify, this shows that organisms are preprogrammed with mechanisms to properly respond to environmental triggers. These systems were refined and passed down through millennia’s of adaptations. In a sense, these systems are an ancestral record or bank of knowledge, passed down through generations of offspring to better equip them for the obstacles presented by the physical world. These systems inspire organisms to hunt, forage, seek security, reproduce, as well as many other things.

To show an example of how it works in practice, one of these systems is responsible for dealing with danger; the fight or flight system (more broadly speaking, FEAR). This systems goal is to help organisms detect threats in the environment and react accordingly. Now imagine an archetypal situation: you are hiking through the woods when all of sudden you hear a suspicious crackle in the leaves not to far from you. Upon looking you notice your being stalked by a mountain lion. You freeze up and your heart beats faster as your body prepares to run or fight. What happened here? First, your perception was triggered by an environmental trigger, the mountain lion. Without you putting any effort, your body naturally prepares you to deal with this threat by altering your physiology to better facilitate active movement. On top of this, your phenomenologically struck by an overwhelming sense of fear, your body’s way of not letting you ignore the immediate threat your faced with; painting your perception with a relevant and meaningful narrative: the hunted.

The Parallels

I will now attempt to draw the connections between this information and Jung’s notion of the collective unconscious to show what aspects of it are empirically supported. First, you must understand the concept that brain and mind are intimately connected. Monism or dualism are not important here, just understand that when something occurs in the brain there is a reaction in the mind, and vice versa. Now for the connections:

1.) The neural systems detailed above are shared by all species to varying degrees. What this implies is that there is a template of mind, which is indeed true. All minds share these unconscious operating systems which interpret environmental events in a meaningful way, and evoke a proper response out of the organism. With these systems being homologous throughout species, we could reasonably conclude that these systems make up the neural/physical representation of the collective unconscious.

2.) These systems imbue our perception with meaning. The idea of meaning is almost indistinguishable from archetypes, with Jung describing how these unconscious contents are essentially the source of all meaning. And just as archetypes are all around us, the products of these neural systems are too. It seems these systems project archetypal narratives onto the world around us to allow us to move through the world in a meaningful way. This is seen in the mountain lion example, with the fight or flight system projecting the archetype of the beast onto the mountain lion. This could also be seen in the systems responsible for love projecting the archetype of the anima/animus onto the object of desire.

Spiritual Speculation (Creation Story)

Based on these parallels, the idea that the collective unconscious is universally shared and the source of all meaning is not at all unreasonable, and is empirically supported to a large degree. So we now have a base to branch off of: there exists and aspect of consciousness that is universal and home to all which is meaningful. On the other hand, we have physical reality which exists independent of this realm of consciousness.

From this we can form a sort of story. There exists two worlds: an objective reality, cold and void; and a subjective realm, deep and rich with meaning. Objective reality is finite and exists in certainty, while the subjective realm is amorphous and infinite, being simultaneously beautiful and horrid. Between this chasm of worlds exists a bridge: organisms. The organism is a part of the objective world existing as a sort of vessel for the subjective realm to inhabit. As the subjective realm inhabits this vessel it takes on all its finities by conforming to the structure of its biological limitations (for example, sensory organs). In doing so, the subjective realm takes on the form of an individual, in a sense becoming a soul. The soul walks its path through the objective world, experiencing it from the shoes of its vessel, in the process turning the once cold dead world into a place of meaning and potential, leaving behind it stories of good and bad. But in the end all vessels face the inevitable faith of reality: death. And all souls return to there source, the heavens and hells of the collective unconscious.

Link to Jakk Panksepps Affective Neuroscience:

https://www.amazon.com/Affective-Neuroscience-Foundations-Emotions-Science/dp/019517805X

Okay, returning now..

I'm just echoing what I'm reading of others who are deep in psychotherapeutic work and/or research; Jung's model and theoretical positions are finding correspondence to other more contemporary positioning and propositions constructed via the route of cognitive science, neuroscience, developmental psychology, dream research and so on. Apparently.

Here's a link regarding psychiatrist Erik Goodwyn's text The Neurobiology of the Gods. In this he outlines how Jung's dream theories and modeling are cohering to current dream research perspectives, among other congruities of a Jungian perspective (of note, he has published more since the publication of this material so presumably he has developed further the Jungian links?).

John Haule, a Jungian analyst, has published a couple of volumes of what is said to be an ongoing series of books called Jung in the 21st Century. He asserts he has researched 300 or so neuroscience papers, and similarly finds convergences of Jungian perspectives and thought in current empirical research and theoretical positioning.

Preface to John Ryan Haule's Jung in the 21st Century

Jean Knox, another Jungian analyst and psychiatrist, also finds connections between Jungian concepts and perspectives and more recent findings. A couple of the books she has published here and here.

I haven't read Knox very deeply yet, only cursorily (in a paper where she draws connections with a cognitive science concept image-schemas and archetypes), but her pov is thought provoking and promising.

I started to compile links to some papers that sit in the regions of empiricism and Jungian territory here but I haven't got much further with that particular angle on things yet, distracted by other concerns.

Edit: another link
to a paper not in that list, Recent Neurological Studies Supportive of Jung’s Theories on Dreaming, Robert J Hoss, M.S.

(Note: if you can't access the papers linked to there pm me, there's options).

So..I'm not sure what to make of it presently, other than it tentatively looks like there is some validation of Jung's ideas taking place or able to be mapped in regards to some regions of the sciences.

On framing and approaching science, Jung says in CW 7:

>A genuinely scientific attitude must be unprejudiced. The sole criterion for the validity of an hypothesis is whether or not it possesses an heuristic—i.e., explanatory—value.

para.216

Additionally, in the same volume he states:

>.. Everything about this psychology is, in the deepest sense, experience; the entire theory, even where it puts on the most abstract airs, is the direct outcome of something experienced.

Ibid., para.199

>For me, scientific research work was never a milch-cow or a means of prestige, but a struggle, often a bitter one, forced upon me by daily psychological experience of the sick. Hence not everything I bring forth is written out of my head, but much of it comes from the heart also, a fact I would beg the gracious reader not to overlook if, following up the intellectual line of thought, he comes upon certain lacunae that have not been properly filled in. A harmonious flow of exposition can be expected only when one is writing about things which one already knows. But when, urged on by the need to help and to heal, one acts as a path-finder, one must speak also of realities as yet unknown.

Ibid., para.200

>..So every man whose fate it is to go his individual way must proceed with hopefulness and watchfulness, ever conscious of his loneliness and its dangers. The peculiarity of the way here described is largely due to the fact that in psychology, which springs from and acts upon real life, we can no longer appeal to the narrowly intellectual, scientific standpoint, but are driven to take account of the standpoint of feeling, and consequently of everything that the psyche actually contains. In practical psychology we are dealing not with any generalized human psyche, but with individual human beings and the multitudinous problems that oppress them. A psychology that satisfies the intellect alone can never be practical, for the totality of the psyche can never be grasped by intellect alone. Whether we will or no, philosophy keeps breaking through, because the psyche seeks an expression that will embrace its total nature.

Ibid., para.201

Still reads as relevant to me (but I'm priorly biased and predisposed to consider the feeling dimension, phenomenological and parapsychological regions of psyche).

Hope that gives you something to go on after your own interests, if you weren't already familiar with the material.

I identify with this a lot. There's always something to research, something to study, some distraction that makes me feel like I'm accomplishing something when I'm really just procrastinating.


The key is to just get started, I know that sounds like no advice at all, because the whole point is that you can't get started. 'I know what to do, so why don't I do it?' That whole thing. Easiest way to start getting past that:
Commit to 5 minutes of work, right when you think of something you should do.


"I need to work on this Excel model for work, but really I should go watch a Youtube video on the proper functions to use for it, that would help me get it done faster."


Commit to 5 minutes of just starting, tell yourself that afterward you will allow yourself to go watch the video. In my experience most of the resistance is anticipatory anxiety, and once you get started actually doing work you'll continue to do so.


I have spent years, like you, looking for some breakthrough, some event, to help "fix" this aspect of myself. Recently come to the conclusion that it is not an event, it is a process. A continual, constant, unyielding process.


Are you a middle child by chance? This is a very common occurrence in middle children.
I recommend this book regardless:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/0465016901/?coliid=I1IGTGRCI4ZPIC&colid=3P9G7HPN0FU02&psc=1&ref_=lv_ov_lig_dp_it

The shadow is just a place in your psyche. It's filled with anything that's been repressed, taboo'd, or any behavior not condoned by "normal" society. I'd read Bly's "Little Book on the Human Shadow" as he provides a really good intro.


Everyone's shadows will be similar, but different. For example, depending on the culture you're raised in, different things will be taboo'd. Or, your personal dispositions will lead you to certain behaviors, which you may find undesirable, so you yourself send it to the shadow domain.


Take this in consideration that what I described is the equivalent of cocktail-napkin-math. The shadow, its projections, and all things revolving around that can get pretty complex. I just put a dot on the map and those books will help you find the trail.


Bly's Book -- https://www.amazon.com/Little-Book-Human-Shadow/dp/0062548476/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=little+book+on+the+human+shadow&qid=1572911764&sr=8-1


King, Warrior, Magician, Lover -- https://www.amazon.com/King-Warrior-Magician-Lover-Rediscovering/dp/0062506064/ref=sr_1_1?crid=3BFOJK9R67ANN&keywords=king+warrior+magician+lover&qid=1572912042&sprefix=King+warrior%2Caps%2C167&sr=8-1

https://www.amazon.com/She-Understanding-Psychology-Robert-Johnson/dp/0060963972

A good start.
Kudos to you for braving down a dark road that will yield to lasting light if you just persevere, do the work, and remain compassionate towards yourself.

I think Memories, Dreams, Reflections is the best one to start with. Jung's writing is so dense that getting to know him and his thinking first is helpful and the auto-biographical form facilitates that. As far as his scholarly works The Archetypes and the Collective Unconsciousness or Psychological Types are excellent places to start to get some idea of the basic outlays of his thinking. My problem as i progressed through some of the other works is i read them "out of order." Reading the collected works straight through isn't necessary but some of the works require you to have read previous works (I'm thinking here mostly of his alchemical works (I tried to read Alchemical Studies without having first read Mysterium Coniunctionis or Psychology and Alchemy...not recommended))

Maybe the Portable Jung for you m8 :)

He was definitely a mystic. Have you read the Red Book?

Check this out
https://www.amazon.com/Jung-Mystic-Esoteric-Dimensions-Teachings/dp/0399161996

I'm now sorting through the 140+ journal articles I have saved over the past 10 years. The main problem I'm facing now is that only 5% of the file names actually reflect the journal article name. This will take a day or two of work.

Also, you may wish to check out these two books that I bought a few years ago:

Coming into Mind: The Mind-Brain Relationship: A Jungian Clinical Perspective https://www.amazon.com/dp/1583917098/

Changing Minds in Therapy: Emotion, Attachment, Trauma, and Neurobiology (Norton Series on Interpersonal Neurobiology) https://www.amazon.com/dp/0393705617/

There was a book in the 70's "A Whack on the Side of the Head"

There's a book by a psychologist named June Singer which helped me out. It's called Boundaries Of The Soul: The Practice of Jung's Psychology.

I'm guessing you mean mother complex! As far as I understand it is the regressive tendency in a man, the part of you that basically wants to return to the womb, for all of life's challenges to just go away so you can be looked after again by your mummy. Part of the male journey of individuation involves overcoming this tendency once and for all. The hero's quest to defeat the dragon can be symbolic of us striving to defeat the mother complex - this is talked about in the excellent book He: Understanding Masculine Psychology, which I highly recommend.

Having said that I'm no expert so I'll leave a deeper definition for someone else!