(Part 3) Top products from r/Vegetarianism

Sure, thanks for asking :) you were the first who provided a valid point on the vegan side for the whole B12 deal. I've read this as well, that we live "too clean" nowadays, reducing the chance to get B12 on many levels. However if animal products, amongst other nutrients, contain decent amounts of B12 in it's natural form (meaning no pill needed to be manufactured, packaged, and delivered to your local supplement store), there are only more questions raised.

My statement is based on experience (I've been trying out different diets / lifestyles for 16+ years now), and on the following:

Here's an interesting link first: https://www.nps.gov/rowi/learn/news/the-tree-root-that-ate-roger-williams.htm

The apple tree, after a long time, consumed - "ate" - Mr. Williams' body. Basically, used his nutrients. That's what all in our world does, regardless of life type; Bacteria, insects, animals, plants, all eat, for nutrition, and try to reproduce as much and as fast as they can. All life forms are set up to consume a certain amount of nutrients, from certain sources. That's a fact, regardless of how we feel about it.

Throughout history our bodies got used to animal consumption 100% - fats, proteins, all of it, nothing is left out, compared to vegetables' cellulose. There's nothing our body leaves out undigested.

It also got used to eating nuts, and random amounts of fruits, and vegetables (being season-dependent of course). This whole concept changed about 10-15.000 years ago with agriculture. To this day, archeologists can show differences of bone density, and general health differences between old societies that stayed hunter-gatherers, and those that switched to grains / rice / maize crops. Here's what I found: https://proteinpower.com/drmike/2009/04/22/nutrition-and-health-in-agriculturalists-and-hunter-gatherers/

So as per this link, as soon as agriculture became more and more popular, our health got involved, in many aspects.

Now, I'm not convinced of course that regular activity cannot better the state of bone density for instance. Vegan crossfitters are great example of extra healthy, vegetable-based diets with great outcomes.

Getting back to the subject - connection between B12 and veganism being unhealthy, my base thought was inspired by this book: https://www.amazon.com/Vegetarian-Myth-Food-Justice-Sustainability/dp/1604860804

I'm not judging anybody, on the contrary, I think it's very noble to decide you don't want to partake in the living hell we call the meat industry today. I'm questioning the natural aspect of it. My goal, in my life, is to be as natural, and as close to my general requirements as possible. I eat local, and mostly bio products. But that's me.

There are various, other great effects of becoming vegan. But is it really healthy? Is it sustainable? Is it really a "natural form of living", when even on the basic nutrients, like iron, and vitamin B12 one would need to get supplements? Iron of course is easier to come by - spinach, broccoli, and other greenies are full if them. Beans too! But my basic argument is that all living beings should find their natural equilibrium in our world's system. We also are consumed by mother nature, we also should follow the course on which we are set. Let me know what you think.

What is the B12 supplement made of btw? Is it from the bacteria found in dirt? Isn't that also a type of living being then? So how is that different from eating a mackerel that you cought 20km from your city's shore? (Cought, not farmed) = I think it can be ethical to eat seafood.

I like The Vegan Table for American food.

Quick Vegetarian Dishes has a variety of recipes from around the world. Not one uses tofu or fake meat. (One note: The recipes use Australian measurements, which are slightly different than American. It only really matters if you're baking, though, and even then, it is easy to adjust for.)

For Indian food, Lord Krishna's Cuisine: The Art of Indian Vegetarian Cooking seems to have hundreds of great recipes in it, but not a single one with fake meats or tofu.

I have all three of these, and have really enjoyed the recipes. Happy cooking!

The Flexitarian Diet--first cookbook I ever bought as an adult; best cookbook I own. I am constantly referring back to it--the recipes are genuinely simple and so good.