(Part 2) Best christian spiritual growth books according to redditors
We found 944 Reddit comments discussing the best christian spiritual growth books. We ranked the 363 resulting products by number of redditors who mentioned them. Here are the products ranked 21-40. You can also go back to the previous section.
Hi /u/iwillyes, I'm glad you're here! Let me start by talking a bit about what the Reformed tradition of Christianity is.
The Reformed Tradition is a branch of Protestant Christianity that developed during the Reformation in Switzerland, Scotland, France and the low countries. John Calvin was (and is) the most influential theologian in the Reformed tradition. While we share many similarities with Anglicans, Baptists and Lutherans we are usually seen as a distinct strand. We disagree on the meaning of both Baptism and the Eucharist, for example (in both regards Lutherans are closer to Catholics). Pentecostals and Anabaptist are quite different.
In terms of what makes the Reformed different from other Protestant groups, I love this quote by Cornelius Plantinga:
>>Our accents lie more on the sovereignty of God, on the authority of Scripture, on the need for disciplined holiness in personal Christian life, and finally, on Christianity as a religion of the Kingdom.
That emphasis on the sovereignty of God over all things is in my mind what most clearly distinguishes the reformed tradition. Part of that is understanding God to be sovereign in salvation - what is commonly known as the five points of Calvinism. Basically we believe that because of we are dead in our sin, man is utterly unable to do anything to save himself - even unable to turn to God. It is only through God's grace of drawing us to him that we are able to have the faith that saves us. This means that we contribute nothing to our own salvation - it is entirely a work of God.
In the U.S. there are two main groups of Reformed churches: Presbyterians (the Scottish Reformed) and the Dutch Reformed. Historically Scottish Reformed have put a bit more emphasis on personal piety (the Puritans are part of this group) while the Dutch Reformed have put slightly more emphasis on declaring the Lordship of Christ over all creation. But, we are very, very similar. The Reformed tradition is a deeply confessional one. We hold to historic documents that describe what we understand scripture to teach on a wide range of matters. The Presbyterians hold to the Westminster Confession of Faith and the Dutch Reformed hold to the Three Forms of Unity. While different documents, the two sets of confessions essentially teach the same doctrine.
In terms of churches the large (100k+ members) Presbyterian denominations in the US are the Presbyterian Church (USA), the Presbyterian Chrurch in America. the Evangelical Presbyterian Church, and ECO: A Covenant Order of Presbyterians. The PC(USA) is a more "liberal" church while the others are more "conservative" to varying degrees. The two large Dutch Reformed denominations are the Reformed Church in America and the Christian Reformed Church. There are also many smaller Presbyterian and Reformed denominations. Many of them are part of the North American Presbyterian and Reformed Council.
What complicates things a bit is that in recent years, many Christians in other traditions have started using "reformed" to mean they have a Calvinistic view of salvation, even if they don't fit into the broader reformed tradition in other ways. You will find a lot of Baptists who have a Calvinistic view of salvation, but not of the sacraments or the church, for example. This sub tends to attract both the more conservative branch of the Reformed tradition as well as those who just have a Calvinistic view of salvation.
In terms of books, my number one recommendation for you is Letters to a Young Calvinist: An Invitation to the Reformed Tradition by Jamie Smith. It's a quick easy read best digested in small parts. It does a great job of providing an overview of the Reformed tradition that is accessible, theological, and pastoral. It's aimed at those who have a 'come-to-Calvin' moment from within other theological traditions (Smith was pentecostal), but would benefit everyone.
Also read through some of the Reformed Confessions. The best place to start is with the Heidelberg Catechim and the Belgic Confession. If you want a more modern approach, I'd encourage you to also read the Christian Reformed Church's Contemporary Testimony Our World Belongs To God, too.
Other good "intro" level books:
Once you feel ready for higher level stuff, I recommend:
I will submit a Christian opinion if you don't mind Reddit. I think everyone needs to question their Faith. My advice is to get away from the Catholic church and explore different philosophies and definitely read some Christian literature as well. A few suggestions:
Mere Christianity - C.S. Lewis
The Language of God - Francis Collins
What's So Great About Christianity - Dinesh D'souza
Go explore for yourself. Actually reading and thinking about things for yourself is much more satisfying than sitting in religion class and being told to blindly follow. Best of luck!
John Calvin - A Little Book on the Christian Life
> What’s hard is that I don’t know what to do.
Just an observation friend, but it appears that you're measuring your spirituality by what you do rather than by who you are. In other words, you feel that you're a good Christian on the days when you read the Bible and pray but you feel like a bad Christian on the days when you don't.
It would seem to me that the cure here is to make an internal switch into a deeper acceptance of the Gospel. When Jesus died for our sins, he freed us forever from condemnation and performance. You're just as much a child of God on the days when you don't measure up to your internal standards as on the days when you do good deeds.
If this resonates, a book I'd recommend is this: Victory over the Darkness by Neil Anderson. The message is simple and powerful - if we try to act from a mindset of, "I have to do these things so I'll be a good Christian" we will burn out. If instead we change our mindset to, "I am a child of God seated with Christ in the heavens. Jesus paid for all of my failures and He loves me very much, regardless of if I have good or bad days." - then we will change how we live simply because it's who we are.
Regardless - praying for God's wisdom and guidance for you in this hard season.
Three books I recommend highly:
Thom Stark's The Human Faces of God. If you only read one book about the Bible before giving up on it, please make sure it's this one.
Scot McKnight's The King Jesus Gospel does a great job of laying out the ways in which the story the Bible is trying to tell has been distorted and misunderstood by a focus on personal salvation.
N.T. Wright's How God Became King makes a similar case, but fleshes it out from a more scholarly perspective and addresses the political implications of the gospel.
based on the comments and downvotes, I think some people are simply reading the first few bullets. Read the whole thing!
Christian here. I'm all for Gay marriage, but I read this fairly terrible book, so I can give you a pretty good idea of what the thought process is.
The idea is sort of a multi-headed monster of independent arguments, none of which are particularly good. I'll summarize some of the ones I remember from Turek's book:
There are probably more that I don't remember, but who cares - they aren't good arguments anyway. Let's quickly debunk them.
So far, this has probably been a fairly reasonable post for a non-Christian to read and agree with. Now, here's why I get into my personal belief: I believe that homosexuality is a sin issue, just like the dozens of sin issues that I have in all kinds of other areas (porn, drinking, premarital heterosexual sex, etc). Just because I don't happen to struggle with homosexuality doesn't mean that I can condemn people that do (you'll notice this a lot with Christians, you'll have a racist bigot struggling to understand that we're supposed to love people singling out someone that struggles with, I don't know, lying - because he personally doesn't struggle with lying, and can't relate to the person). However, according to my beliefs, it's a sin issue.
Now, the fun part that will get most of you back on board: just because I believe it is wrong doesn't mean I can/should allow myself to influence the legal ability of non-Christians to engage in acts I deem inappropriate. If you are not a Christian, if you do not believe as I do, then why listen to what I have to say? We're supposed to treat people as Jesus did, and I'm not sure trying to prevent non-Christian gay people from getting married (yes, notice I made a distinction- perhaps it might be acceptable for Christians to try to prevent Christians struggling with homosexuality to engage in homosexual acts, just as it would be acceptable for Christians to try to prevent Christians that struggle with stealing compulsively from walking into Macy's and stealing jewelry. But again, if you're not a Christian, this doesn't make sense).
Well, that's the idea.
tl;dr - many of the arguments Christians pose against gay marriage are inconsistent and non-biblical.
It's a difficult path to be sure. I wouldn't describe my situation as being so deleterious as yours seems but there are certainly many parallels. If you're a reader I would suggest some works that have helped me in various ways:
On the other hand there is this quote, attributed to Confucius, that has been sticking in my craw:
"We have two lives, and the second begins when we realize we only have one."
May I recommend this book:
Finding God in the Waves: How I Lost My Faith and Found It Again Through Science https://www.amazon.com/dp/1101906049/
It sounds like you're in a similar place to this author. His journey helped me with some of my toughest questions. What's great is while he provides some answers, what's more important is that he embraces discovery and faith.
Ligonier had a book giveaway a while back and I got a free copy of A Little Book On The Christian Life. I thought it was a nice intro to Calvin's writing.
Like any complicated topic, you don't start at that level. That's like going in Physics 101 expecting to learn Einstein's relativity on day one. There's a lot of developmental work to be done before you can get it. C.S. Lewis has a really interesting book called The Four Loves that goes into how four very different greek words for different types of love (friendship love, erotic love, familial love, and self-sacrificial love) that delves a bit into the difficulties of translations but also gets into how language changes how people think.
You can tell a lot about people from the words in their languages. In English, we only have a few types of words for snow/ice, but in many Inuit languages, there are dozens of specific words for differing types of snow/ice, which makes sense, given how big a part of their lives that winter weather entails.
To your point on how can we ever really know what someone means, that's always going to be an issue. We're speaking the same language, and I'm not 100% sure what you mean in your statement. There is always going to be the possibility of miscommunication, but that's no reason to abandon trying to have good communication out of a fear of imperfect communication. We just have to do the best we can when talking to each other, or when trying to figure out if translations are reliable or not.
Tell your story. Narrate the role that Jesus has in your life and how important He is to you.
Then, when they might be ready, invite them to allow you to introduce them to Jesus.
When that moment comes then you tell them Jesus' story. Don't give them rules, regulations, nor theology. Tell them Jesus' story, just the story.
Here's a great book to help you better express the story of Jesus
Thank you.
Now that I'm back home, here are some recommendations. First, I might note that while /u/johnnytoomuch's post has some good links in it, the truth is that for someone new to the whole Orthodoxy thing, that's all going to be hitting the ground too hard and fast.
So here are my recommendations, geared towards somebody totally new to Orthodoxy (I'd say beginner, but we're all beginners, even the likes of St. Theophon the Recluse).
I'd also ask the priest what book he uses for his inquirers class.
* For a layman, the horologion and psalter (if you have a Bible, you have the psalter) are the core of it. You do not need and should probably not purchase your own copy of the Menaion (the books that give the hymns for feasts and saints) or the Ochtoechos (the books that give the hymns for the tone of the week). I'm also not mentioning the Triodion (the book of Lent) or Pentecostarion (the book of Pascha). The other 7 books are generally clergy books or books for specific occasions.
You are not alone. I’ve gone through the same thing, and these are some books that helped me, from people who also went through periods of serious doubt.
Faith Unraveled, by Rachel Held Evans
The Sin of Certainty, by Peter Enns
Rachel, in particular, was super helpful for me.
If anyone is willing to drop about $8, you can get a small book that contains Calvin's chapter on the Christian Life from his Institutes of the Christian Religion. It's a nice introduction to Calvin's non-TULIP theology. It should be applicable to Calvinists and non-Calvinists alike.
Lost me at "to get into Heaven."
This makes a common mistake of assuming the only reason for the Incarnation was for Jesus to die on the cross, and everything else in between was just filler. That's what this book does a good job of addressing.
Washed and Waiting by Wesley Hill. Written by a "Gay Celibate Christian" and I think provides a pretty good counterpoint to the emerging understanding of homosexuality and Christianity.
Chosen by God by R.C. Sproul. For those wanting to learn a bit more about Calvinism/Reformed theology, Chosen by God is an easy primer that walks readers through the TULIP of Calvinism. At the end of the day, whether you agree with Sproul's conclusions or not, you will at least have a better understanding of why Reformed Christians believe what we believe.
The heart of Christianity is, of course, Jesus Christ. If you feel like you've been dwelling on a lot of abstract, philosophical-theological arguments for awhile I strongly reccomend meditating upon Simply Jesus. That one's by NT Wright.
I’d highly recommend this book for you.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B01LO3MCDY/ref=tmm_aud_title_0?ie=UTF8&qid=1523841328&sr=8-1
The author identifies as a non-theist Christian mystic and he describes a visionary experience he had and how he reacted (which first involved assuming a brain tumor and getting a scan!)
I’m not the type to have visions. There’s some evidence that certain people have a genetic susceptibility to these types of experiences, and it’s an entirely separate thing from the type of hallucinations that, for example, someone with schizophrenia might have when off their meds.
But whatever the trigger, the human mind is a meaning-making machine. In many cultures, a coming-of-age ceremony would be designed to induce a visionary experience (via fasting, pain, or hallucinogens) that would help the young man find his place in life and his tribe.
I’d encourage you to make meaning for your life from this vision you had. Whatever you end up believing about Jesus, you did have this experience, and it can help you find purpose in life. Maybe the meaning you’ll take from it is that you want your own life to be broken and poured out as a sacrifice for others.
I'm not very well-versed in universal themes, or in Islam, but I have a few sources that might help you with some of the Christian side of your research:
The Christian Classics Ethereal Library has free PDFs of many primary sources from the early church fathers. Christian belief has taken many different forms over the last two millennia, and seeing some of their unique perspectives might help inspire you.
Also, The Mosaic of Christian Belief covers a lot of the different views held by different Christian groups today. If you're looking for a wide variety of thoughts and positions, it might be a good place to start.
Edit:
For Christian ethics, you might look at N.T. Wright's book After You Believe, or Samuel Wells' Christian Ethics: An Introductory Reader which includes a lot of great selections from different writers throughout history.
I recommend Chosen by God or What is Reformed Theology?, both by RC Sproul.
Something that might be useful to keep in mind is that Calvin did not write down the five points typically attributed to him. Instead, the Arminians challenged the traditional Reformed theology, and were refuted at Dordt with these five points. (You can read the Canons of Dordt at www.reformed.org under "Historic Documents").
The reason I point this out is that these 5 points do not stand on their own really. They start to make a lot more sense when you keep them in the context of the rest of reformed theology (e.g., the idea of the covenant, and the means of grace).
As far as Limited Atonement, the idea is that Christ's death actually accomplished our redemption, not just made it possible. It's also called "particular redemption". It's really a question of efficacy and intent, though - Dordt taught that Christ's death "is of infinite value and worth, more than sufficient to atone for the sins of the whole world" but that "it was God's will that Christ through the blood of the cross (by which he confirmed the new covenant) should effectively redeem from every people, tribe, nation, and language all those and only those who were chosen from eternity to salvation and given to him by the Father."
The book is very good, IMHO.
> I was raised to believe that the Bible is inerrant and aside from parables and metaphors, to take it all literally.
There's absolutely life and faith possible outside of the fragile notion of Biblical inerrancy. If you like to read, I'd recommend the book Finding God in the Waves by Mike McHargue. I found it to be a wonderful account of no longer running from your doubts and finding God without needing to deceive yourself.
> How do you rationalize years of church history that firmly believed these gifts ended, but now all of a sudden they are a thing again?
Have you read either of these two books?
Essentially, there have been documented miracles (I understand that a cessationist would consider this to be different than a gift) in every century since Pentecost. Ruthven's book is considered one of the most formative assaults on cessationism and any self-proclaiming cessationist is doing themselves a disservice if they haven't read it.
Here are links that christs-bridezilla could provide:
Which James White? I hear good things about Dr. James Emery White, though I have never read any of his works.
This James White is a different story. He's not really a "doctor", all his doctoral degrees come from an unaccredited institution. I haven't interacted with his work too much, mostly because he comes across as a bit arrogant and confrontational in the works I have read. His apologetic work often strikes me as disingenuous, uncharitable, and often pseudo-historical towards those he is arguing against, especially Roman Catholics.
I do have quite a few books I would recommend:
First, I would read the following:
The Heidelberg Catechism, The Belgic Confession, and the Canons of Dort
These are collectively referred to as the "Three Forms of Unity", and are the baseline documents for continental Reformed (Calvinist) churches. In addition, I recommend the following:
Good Introductions
Letters to a Young Calvinist by James K.A. Smith
Calvinism in the Las Vegas Airport by Richard J. Mouw
What is Reformed Theology? by R.C. Sproul
A Little Book on the Christian Life by John Calvin
Digging Deeper
Pilgrim Theology by Michael Horton
The Christian Faith by Michael Horton
The Institutes of the Christian Religion in the 1536, 1541, or 1559 editions by John Calvin. Also available online here
Reformed Dogmatics by Herman Bavinck
Systematic Theology by Louis Berkhof
As well anything by the following authors:
Modern: R.C. Sproul, Michael Horton, James K.A. Smith, Cornelius Plantinga, Alvin Plantinga, John Piper, and Tim Keller.
1800s & 1900s: J. Gresham Machen, Herman Bavinck, Abraham Kuyper, G.C. Berkouwer, and B.B. Warfield
Pre-1800s: Jonathan Edwards, John Calvin, Theodore Beza, and John Knox
Some people here might not like his take on 2 kingdoms theology, but Michael Horton's "Ordinary" was really helpful to me about a year and a half ago when I was a sophomore in college. His take (which is, I believe, the correct Reformed take) on what the Christian life looks like and how we should find fulfillment put me at peace with pursuing a career outside of the ministry.
For a first step into biblical study, I'm not sure I would only read Carrier's book. As I haven't read it fully, I can't really comment on it like /u/koine_lingua.
But if you want to get a broad spectrum, you can check out:
John Meier Marginal Jew - (maybe vol. 2 or 3)
NT Wright's How God Became King
John Dominic Crossan's Jesus: A Revolutionary Biography
Marcus Borg Jesus: An uncovering the Life, Teachings, and Relevance of a Religious Revolutionary
Craig Blomberg Jesus and the Gospels: An Introduction and Survey
You can take a stab at Albert Schweitzer's The Quest for the Historical Jesus
or Raymond E. Brown's Death of the Messiah or Birth of the Messiah if you want. I found Schweitzer's book difficult to get through. And one Easter holiday my plans were to read Death of the Messiah. After page like 17, I quit and played WoW.
That will give you a healthy dose of different perspectives - and will not only give you a survey of the scholarship but also will argue for a model, as opposed to Luke Timothy Johnson's The Real Jesus which just criticizes one aspect of HJ studies.
http://www.tentmaker.org/articles/universalism-refuted.htm
Above link gives a good explanation. I'm not 100% on universalism but I'm about 95%.
When I ask the Lord about it, His answer comes in the form of proverbs 3:5 - "Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding"
Universalism or not, God is perfect love. Someday He will fix everything. He will wipe away every tear. We will never again have a reason to cry. I trust Him above everything and it's brought so much peace to my life. He led me to universalism when I was going through a tough time. Believing it brings no harm as long as it's understood to be secondary to God's will. In the end it's all ideas and words. God will accomplish His will and purpose no matter our beliefs or personal feelings on the subject. He is sovereign.
ETA: this is a really thorough, impartial book on the three christian views of hell. When christianity first started universalism was one of three equally valid views of hell and this book breaks down each view and defends them using the bible. Incredible book, surprisingly easy to read and understand. Universalism didn't get a bad rap until catholicism took over. It has as much scriptural support as the other two views, if not more.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00EQE3FJE/ref=dp-kindle-redirect?_encoding=UTF8&btkr=1
If you have any questions about the Sermon on the Mount, this book is a great place to start.
Yeah, Anglicans generally believe in some sort of Real Presence.
The book I had in mind was Bread and Water, Wine and Oil by Meletios Webber. It goes through the hows and whys of prayer and fasting, and the seven sacraments, from an Orthodox perspective. It's also written for the layperson, so it's easy to read.
I'm afraid I can't supply a source, since this is Frank Turek's work, but you can find the book on Amazon if you really want to know?
I like this book from the sidebar.
It's not a video, but if you're open to reading something, NT Wright's Simply Jesus for an thorough examination of how Jesus fulfilled the Old Covenant and created the New Covenant around his person.
If you're a reader, I strongly suggest The Divine Conspiracy
You can't expect to get answers to all of your questions in a couple of paragraphs on reddit, but Willard address this topic directly. What does it look like to be a Christian today, what is our role and calling? Great book, highly recommend it.
Based on a recommendation from this sub: Ordinary by Michael Horton.
There’s a book that spends a few chapters circling around the despairing nature of Ecclesiastes, Job, and some of the darker Psalms called The Sin of Certainty. I’m paraphrasing, but the author argues that Ecclesiastes is an absolute gift to Christians. It’s a humbling reminder that God’s followers don’t have everything figured out, and that life makes sense without God. Two concepts that are too hard to tackle in most churches. Yet, there’s an underlying current of hope—of trust—that despite our best attempts to make sense and understand a seemingly senseless universe, that there’s a supreme Creator that transcends our understanding and existence.
And it’s that trust that elicits worship in spite of existential and epistemological crises that all Christians undergo but most just sweep under a rug and try not to deal with it. Ecclesiastes is what it looks like when you “deal with it.”
Great question.
I have recently finished the bait of satan which has slightly changed views on this.
In general, my thoughts go this way.
[1] The goal is always to restore relationships and restore people to fellowship.
[2] The individual who sees the problem has the responsibility to make contact with the person accused of sinning / "walking disorderly". In this I mean that you don't just bring an accusation before the elders without talking to the person first.
[3] If the person refuses to acknowledge and repent of their sin, then you bring a witness (for the protection of the person accused) to verify that you tried to restore fellowship in bringing up the issue.
[4] If the one accused of disorderly conduct refuses to admit their sin and accept forgiveness then it goes before the elders.
[5] If they refuse to acknowledge the issue before the elders then the issue is brought before the congregation.
[6] It is only at this point where the congregation treats them like a non-believer.
****
In my experience as a pastor, some people are called to be a support / anchor to this person. These are often the close family and friends who feel God's call to stay close, but affirm he church's position. Others in the congregation will reduce their fellowship while the person is under church discipline.
Here is a part of the book mentioned above
**
APPROACHING SOMEONE WHO HAS OFFENDED YOU
Now that we have discussed what to do when we offend our brother, let’s consider what to do if our brother offends us.
Moreover if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother.
—Matthew 18:15
Many people apply this Scripture verse in a different attitude from the one Jesus was intending. If they have been hurt, they will go and confront the offender in a spirit of revenge and anger. They use this verse as justification to condemn the one who has hurt them.
But they are missing the whole reason Jesus instructed us to go to one another. It is not for condemnation but for reconciliation. He does not want us to tell our brother how rotten he has been to us. We are to go to remove the breach preventing the restoration of our relationship.
This parallels how God restores us to Himself. We have sinned against God, but He “demonstrates His own love toward [and for] us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us” (Rom. 5:8). Are we willing to lay down our self-protection and die to pride in order to be restored to the one who has offended us? God reached out to us before we asked for forgiveness. Jesus decided to forgive us before we even acknowledged our offense.
Even though He reached out to us, we could not be reconciled to the Father until we received His word of reconciliation.
Now all things are of God, who has reconciled us to Himself through Jesus Christ, and has given us the ministry of reconciliation, that is, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not imputing their trespasses to them, and has committed to us the word of reconciliation. Now then, we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God were pleading through us: we implore you on Christ’s behalf, be reconciled to God.
—2 Corinthians 5:18-20, emphasis added
The word of reconciliation begins on the common ground that we all have sinned against God. We do not desire reconciliation or salvation unless we know there is a separation.
In the New Testament, the disciples preached that the people had sinned against God. But why tell people they have sinned? To condemn them? God does not condemn. “For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved” (John 3:17). Is it rather to bring them to a place where they realize their condition, repent of their sins, and ask forgiveness?
What leads men to repentance? The answer is found in Romans 2:4.
Or do you despise the riches of His goodness, forbearance, and longsuffering, not knowing that the goodness of God leads you to repentance?
-EMPHASIS ADDED
God’s goodness leads us to repent. His love does not leave us condemned to hell. He proved His love by sending Jesus, His only Son, to the cross to die for us. God reaches out first, even though we have sinned against Him. He reaches out not to condemn but to restore—to save.
Since we are to imitate God (see Ephesians 5:1), we are to extend reconciliation to a brother who sins against us. Jesus established this pattern: Go to him and show him his sin, not to condemn him but to remove anything that lies between the two of you and thus be reconciled and restored. The goodness of God within us will draw our brother to repentance and restoration of the relationship.
I, therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you to walk worthy of the calling with which you were called, with all lowliness and gentleness, with longsuffering, bearing with one another in love, endeavoring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.
—Ephesians 4:1-3
We keep this bond of peace by maintaining an attitude of humility, gentleness, and long-suffering and by undergirding each other’s weakness in love. The bonds of love are strengthened thereby.
I have wronged people who have confronted me with condemnation. As a result I lost all desire to be reconciled. In fact, I thought they didn’t want reconciliation; they just wanted me to know they were mad.
Others I have wronged have come to me in meekness. Then I was quick to change my outlook and ask forgiveness—some-times before they had finished speaking.
Has someone ever come to you and said, “I just want you to know that I forgive you for not being a better friend and for not doing this or that for me”?
Then when they have blasted you, they give you a look that says, “You owe me an apology.”
You are baffled and stand there in confusion and hurt. They did not come to reconcile your relationship but to intimidate and control you.
We should not go to a brother who has offended us until we have decided to forgive him from our hearts—no matter how he responds to us. We need to get rid of any feelings of animosity toward him before approaching him. If we don’t, we will probably react out of these negative feelings and hurt him, not heal him.
What happens if we have the right attitude and attempt to reconcile with someone who has sinned against us, but he or she won’t listen?
But if he will not hear, take with you one or two more, that “by the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.” And if he refuses to hear them, tell it to the church. But if he refuses even to hear the church, let him be to you like a heathen and a tax collector.
—Matthew 18:16-17
Each of these progressions has the same goal: reconciliation. In essence Jesus was saying, “Keep trying.” Notice how the one who caused the offense is involved at every step. How often we take offenses to everyone else before we go to the one who sinned against us, as Jesus told us to do! We do this because we have not dealt with our own hearts. We feel justified as we tell everyone our side of the story. It strengthens our cause and comforts us when others agree with how badly we have been treated. There is only selfishness in this type of behavior.
THE BOTTOM LINE
If we keep the love of God as our motivation, we will not fail. Love never fails. When we love others the way Jesus loves us, we will be free even if the other person chooses not to be reconciled to us. Look carefully at the following Scripture verse. God’s wisdom is available for all situations.
If it is possible, as much as depends on you, live peaceably with all men.
—Romans 12:18
He says, “If it is possible,” because there are times when others will refuse to be at peace with us. Or there may be those whose conditions for reconciliation would compromise our relationship with the Lord. In either case it is not possible to restore that relationship.
Notice that God says, “...as much as depends on you.” We are to do everything we can to be reconciled with the other person, as long as we remain loyal to truth. We often give up on relationships too soon.
I will never forget the time when a friend counseled me not to walk away from a very frustrating situation. “John, I know you can find scriptural reasons for walking away. Before you do that, make sure you have fought this in prayer and done all you can to bring the peace of God into this situation.”
Then he added, “You will regret it if you look back one day and ask yourself if you did all you could to save this relationship. It is better to know that you have no other recourse and that you did as much as possible without compromising truth.”
I'd recommend two versions of essentially the same resource by R. C. Sproul:
I recommend you explore mysticism. That word used to terrify me, but I've found comfort in it.
Finding God in the Waves is a fantastic book written by a nontheistic mystic. Contrary to "I found God through science!" in the summary, this book doesn't proselytize. It's a very raw, honest account of one man's struggle to find himself after losing faith in God.
Richard Rohr is technically a Catholic friar. He believes in something like a pantheistic deity that is neither male nor female, and he interprets the crucifixion and resurrection as an archetypal story about moving from "false self" to "true self."
Mevlânâ Rumi was a Sufi Muslim mystic. He's currently one of the most popular poets in America. This translation has been criticized by some liberals for erasing Islam,, but frankly, speaking as a liberal myself, and as someone who struggles with chronic depression, the humanism and gorgeous spiritual content of this book saved my life.
Carl Sagan was an astronomer and a cosmologist. He's one of my heroes. Cosmos describes a gorgeous naturalistic world, grounded thoroughly in science. If you're looking for something to believe, this is a must-read. Said he: "Science is not only compatible with spirituality; it is a profound source of spirituality." (It would be a disservice to not note that this is said after he'd renounced the idea that the spiritual necessarily belonged to anything other than a natural world.)
There’s a lot of good responses here already but I wanted to offer some resources and ideas that have helped me.
First of all, despite what the new atheists say, you don’t need faith to believe in God, which is why there are so many deists in academia. The weight of the scientific evidence alone is enough to conclude that there must be some kind of intelligence behind reality. This includes the fine-tuning argument, a variation of which convinced Antony Flew, a life long atheist academic and strong critic of religion to change his mind about God and embrace deism, and quantum mechanics, which doesn’t prove God’s existence but rather undermines materialist assumptions about the fundamental nature of reality. These findings have convinced others in the scientific community such as lifelong atheist, Richard Conn Henry, a professor of theoretical physics at MIT to embrace deism.
So just based on what’s happening with physics, it’s reasonable to believe that there’s some kind of intelligence behind reality. However, this in no way proves the existence of the God of the Bible.
To support the Christian view of God you can look at the evidence for the reliability of New Testament accounts. This is where faith comes in. You have to decide whether or not you believe that Jesus actually rose from the dead. Obviously, there isn’t a scientific way to definitively prove whether or not an historical event happened. But if you want support for the idea that miracles happen and are relatively common, even today, I’d recommend Craig S Keeners magisterial 2 volume work “Miracles” which details hundreds of modern day miracle accounts.
Other reading:
The Divine Conspiracy by Dallas Willard who was a professor of philosophy for many years at USC, helped me to understand my faith at a deeper level, which has helped immensely. It turns out it’s much easier to believe in something when it actually makes sense to you.
On Guard by William Lane Craig explains many of the logical proofs that other commenters have offered here, which are great but can be really difficult to understand without spending a good amount of time with them.
Atheist Delusions by David Bentley Hart: Hart is a leading Orthodox theologian and philosopher who spends a lot of time talking about the logical incoherence of materialism. All his stuff is great but it’s difficult.
This is just a small sample of what’s out there in terms of apologetics but it’s a start. There’s enough that you could spend your entire life reading compelling arguments for the God’s existence. However, the most effective way to strengthen your faith, in my opinion, is to see how effective the teachings of Jesus are for yourself, to ACTUALLY DO what he says and see how it transforms your life first hand. This is how you make your faith unshakable. Nothing beats personal experience.
I recently studied this issue, and the books I read to help me were Jack Deere's Surprised by the Power of the Spirit and Wayne Grudem's The Gift of Prophecy in the New Testament and Today (Pro) and John MacArthur's Strange Fire and BB Warfield's Counterfeit Miracles (Con). Of those, suprisingly MacArthur's was the most helpful. Strange Fire speaks very directly to your impressions of New Age spirituality in the charismatic movement.
A book that really stirred my thoughts that is related to ultimate judgement: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00EQE3FJE/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_awdb_t1_MLKODbKGZFXEW explores different viewpoints specifically pointing out criticisms and supporting scripture for each. I think it does a good job staying neutral and letting the reader come to their own conclusions. For me, it has made me understand that this is not a simple matter that for a long time I thought was.
RC Sproul has a lot of excellent books for the layman.
Recommended reads would be:
The Holiness of God - Free copy from Ligonier
Chosen by God
What is Reformed Theology?
I also recommend Knowing God by JI Packer
It's a big question you're asking. Lots of people have dedicated their lives to studying it and unfortunately the answer won't ever be known unless God decides to break His silence or the mystery is revealed after we die. The simplified answer though is what you say, the split between Judaism and Christianity is the interpretation of Jesus. A central theme of the Old Testament is a prophesy of a redeeming king to lead the Jewish people. The debate is whether or not Jesus was the fulfillment of the prophesy or just another teacher. The Christian faith requires one coming to the conclusion that Jesus is the messiah the Old Testament prophets spoke of and accepting Him as such. Rob Bell is great but if you're looking for a more academic approach to the Christian faith and its interpretation of Jesus, I would recommend reading NT Wright. He has a book on Jesus that has been very fundamental to my understanding of Him and I think would serve a good way to understand what the Christian religion says claims about Him.
https://www.amazon.com/Simply-Jesus-Vision-What-Matters/dp/0062084399/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1504703893&sr=1-1&keywords=simply+jesus+n.t.+wright
Interesting, I'll have to put that book on my list.
Actually, I have serendipitously been on my own fast moving journey lately on all of this. I have a bevy of books and podcasts on the subject. So, sorry for the giant list.
PODCASTS
The Liturgists Podcast
These guys are two previous conservative baptist types, who went either full atheist or agnostic, and are "reconstructing faith with science, art and music". I recommend listening to their personal stories first, Part 1 & Part 2 just to understand where they are coming from, this series of podcasts may be interesting to you, or may not. They do a great job though. A great podcast on consciousness is the one with Peter Rollins - Philosophy and Radical Theology.
You Made It Weird - Pete Holmes
Pete Holmes the comedian, is also a person who grew up pretty conservative christian, and then went full atheist and then came back to some form of belief in the divine with tons of doubt. A GREAT conversation he had about all of this stuff was, again, with Peter Rollins
Ask Science Mike - Mike McHargue (Same guy on the Liturgist Podcast)
This one is more fun, but he does dive into questions of consciousness, belief, existence, etc.
BOOKS
(Warning, all of these books are from a christian perspective, since that is what I am coming from, so some of these may be more relevant to you than others).
Finding God In The Waves - Mike McHargue
Mikes story, he dives into why science ruined his faith, and why science brought him back.
Velvet Elvis - Rob Bell
This book is mainly about passion in life, and why life matters. Very good book, probably not about consciousness and science as much though.
Insurrection - Peter Rollins
Another book about why doubt is necessary to belief. Again, more christian centric.
And here's just my list of books from the last 3 months.
Love Wins - Rob Bell (If God is real, Hell can't be, or at least, the classic idea of hell)
Jesus Wants To Save Christians Too - Rob Bell & Don Golden
The Sin Of Certainty - Peter Enns
What Is The Bible - Rob Bell
How To Be Here - Rob Bell
The Bible Tells Me So - Peter Enns
The Idolatry Of God - Peter Rollins
The Orthodox Heretic - Peter Rollins
I think you are absolutely right in your assessment of the situation and linking the events of childhood to the beliefs of now. It seems to me that you've precisely identified both the cause and the problem which is impacting your prayer life - even though you understand intellectually that God is good, there's a wall that comes up preventing this truth from entering your heart.
Through this author, I have broken through a wall very similar to what you are expressing here. This book is particularly focused on how to break through this wall into the truth of Scripture:
https://www.amazon.com/Victory-Over-Darkness-Realize-Identity/dp/0764213768/
The backstory of this book is very relevant to the situation, I believe. The author came into the ministry out of a burden: he saw that in Scripture Jesus came to set us free and transform us, but when he looked around, he didn't see many Christians who were living as though what the Bible says were truth for today. So he became a professor at Talbot seminary and ran a graduate course for 10 years in which he worked with Christians who are struggling to believe the Gospel and live a transformed life. This book is what he has discovered as part of personally counselling 2,000 Christians and leading a ministry that has impacted millions.
After going through this author's work I was able to move into persistent prayer. At times I was able to experience uninterrupted prayer that would stretch for hours. It became a delight rather than a burden because I fell in love with God and just wanted to lay at His feet and praise Him. The "switch" for me was allowing the love of God to move from my head to my heart and that changed everything. This book gives super practical guidance and help for doing just this.
Here's a few quotes that capture the heart of the book:
It helped me in a very similar situation that you are in. I'd highly recommend it! (I own it on Kindle and can send it to any email address for two weeks - if you want to read it but don't want to buy it, just PM me an email [throwaway is fine] and I'll shoot you my copy)
I think Pope Francis is sincere, but I also think that it is more complicated than merely "doing what is needed to heal the breach." The Schism is as much about people as it is about theology. Human beings and the relationships between them are complicated at the best of times. The self-understanding of these two communities has been distinct for so long that it is easier to argue than to find common ground. There are currently "Byzantine" Churches in communion with Rome and it hasn't worked out terribly well for a lot of them (though there have been bright spots).
If I might be so bold, the "liberal" people (I don't like that word, but I don't have another one) in both camps can hardly see the point in being separate, though they would like to change things in both their Churches in other ways that would make them unrecognizable. The challenge is to have the "conservative" people satisfied with the process and expected result of re-approachment, enough to establish common cause between them. A traditional Catholic has to see that the Orthodox showing up won't force them to budge on things that they are fighting with progressives in their own Church about. The same with the Orthodox. The famous resistor of "false union" Bishop Mark of Ephesus doesn't just appeal to those seeking to preserve the Orthodox faith, but also traditionally committed Catholics.
And what happens if the Catholics are willing to compromise on a great many things, but the Orthodox get difficult on some point? Would not the Catholics feel abused? "We've come all this way and it hurts us and you still won't give up on point 9?" This has been the problem with the Miaphysites. It looks like all the theological issues have been resolved, but we seem to be left with Saints and Anathemas on both sides that have rooted the problem beyond reconciliation. We seem to be "right there" except we have beloved saints on both sides that effectively said, "you can never go there." What do we do with these saints? How do we understand them?
As for something to read. There are several books depending on your interest in using big words. :)
Lossky would be the heavy weight: http://www.amazon.com/The-Mystical-Theology-Eastern-Church/dp/0913836311/
Though I much prefer Zizioulas, more approachable and puts apophatic theology in balance: http://www.amazon.com/Being-Communion-Personhood-Contemporary-Theologians/dp/0881410292/
Of course Bishop Timothy Ware's book is the usual "internet standard recommendation: http://www.amazon.com/The-Orthodox-Way-Kallistos-Ware/dp/0913836583/
If you want something very approachable (almost no technical terms) and a little more "what does this mean" you might try an introduction to sacramental theology in general: http://www.amazon.com/For-Life-World-Sacraments-Orthodoxy/dp/0913836087/
And probably the least "theological" but I think this is both my wife and my favorite: http://www.amazon.com/Bread-Water-Wine-Oil-Experience/dp/1888212918/
WHAT’S SO GREAT ABOUT CHRISTIANITY
by Dinesh D'Souza
A group in my chruch is reading The Last Week by Borg and Crossan for lent. I added a copy to my kindle app and am thoroughly enjoying it.
Here it is for sale but I’m willing to bet if you access to a local library, they will have it for free.
The Four Loves https://www.amazon.com/dp/0062565397/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_ZOakDbTYY7HW7
First off, make sure she understands the difference between condemning homosexuals and condemning homosexual activity. Saying that you have a problem with sexual activity between two men or two women is completely different from saying you have a problem with people who have homosexual urges, regardless of whether or not they choose to act on them.
Next, I'd ask her why she believes homosexual activity is okay. Is this a special case, or does she believe that any sin against God is fine? If it's a special case, then she's been affected by society; if it's not, then she's got a serious problem with her theology.
If this is a special case in the "to each his own" mindset, then I'd give her reading material like Correct, Not Politically Correct or this article. Other than that, I'd say just listen to her explain why she believes this, and try to make sure you don't say anything bad about other people, regardless of their sexual orientation. In addition to violating one of the most important commandments, nothing will hurt your case more than being mean to other people.
If this isn't an isolated case, and she believes the "to each his own" mindset applies to all aspects of life (and some people do), then point out how this philosophy can't possibly be true if Christianity is true. God created His laws for a reason, and Jesus enforced them because they're necessary. As Christians, we get to "love God and love your neighbor" and just sort of shut down, but we have to remember that we can't just say "Jesus loves me, this I know" and then go do whatever we like.
Above all else, be loving.
I'm a little late on this but there is a pretty good book by N.T. Wright (one the foremost contemporary christian authors) called [After You Believe] (http://www.amazon.com/After-You-Believe-Christian-Character/dp/0061730548/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1398304793&sr=8-1&keywords=after+you+believe)
The book talks about the importance of Christian character and what that means. Basically, so much is made out of getting to the point of accepting Christ but there seems to be a big drop off for people after reaching that point. Wright's book is an explanation of what comes after that conversion moment.
It's not too long and its very well written. You should give it a shot.
There's a book on my reading list that might interest you: The Sin of Certainty: Why God Desires Our Trust More than Our "Correct" Beliefs by Peter Enns. I haven't read it yet, but just the title on its own really speaks to me.
My favorite author is C.S. Lewis,
but a more recent book that is really excellent is [What's So Great about Christianity] (http://www.amazon.com/Whats-So-Great-about-Christianity/dp/1414326017#) Dinesh D'Souza. This author takes the discussion in context of today's issues in a very respectful manner. Particularly those raised in regards to science, mystics, and atheist.
Holy Crap. Literally.
https://www.amazon.com/Bait-Satan-Living-Deadly-Offense/dp/159185413X
Not really on topic as far as this subreddit goes, but read this book!. It's reeeeally good and I think it will speak directly to your background. It's the first thing I thought of when I saw the title of your post. I follow the author and his podcast and he is an incredible resource for those who have been atheists. Or if you don't read the book just listen to him on The Liturgists :)
Yes, yes, yes. If you're an iphone user I recommend the app called Breathe that will walk you through what to do. I also recommend "Silence" by Robert Sardello, and "Finding God in the Waves" by Mike McHargue of Ask Science Mike and The Liturgists fame (link to their enneagram episode). In his chapter on prayer McHargue goes through 3 forms of 'christian' meditation (which I'll pm to you immediately after posting this.) and Sardello speaks on the mystery and comfort in the companionship of Silence (meditation/the holy spirit/the tao).
I recommend the latter for this reason, "Among the things learned is the way out of the confines of the oppressive nature of our egotism, which takes innumerable forms, the most impressive being that of acting as if one's religious demeanor, acquired by reading and even studying what the mystics have experienced and the theologians have theorized about, qualifies one as a lover of Silence." There is some portion of your '3w2-ness' that pushes you to seek efficacious loving and acceptance, helping your S.O. here and at the same time fulfilling some ego fixation in the process.
Sorry for the unsolicited thoughts, hopefully the above resources point you to some peace!
How do you rectify Acts 2:4, 10:44-46, and 19:6 with 1 Cor 12:30 then?
In Acts "they were all filled, and spoke with other tongues"
In 1 Cor "Do all speak in tongues? [no]"
---
and if we are devolving to link debate, here's mine: https://www.amazon.com/Surprised-Power-Spirit-Jack-Deere/dp/0310211271
Reality is unbelievable. You're a glob of atoms that can think. It's crazy stuff.
I liked this podcast episode on faith and doubt. The guest was the author of The Sin of Certainty, which I'd like to read sometime.
The more I go to church, the more I doubt. I just read Mike McHargue's "Finding Faith in the Waves" and it's done more for me than any amount of church attendance has in the past 10 years.
This is absolute bollocks. I strongly recommend CS Lewis' The Four Loves on this issue, where he powerfully argues against this idea.
http://www.amazon.com/The-Bait-Satan-Anniversary-Devotional/dp/159185413X
Will help you be happier and take offense to nearly nothing, while living joyously. Changed my cynical life into a way more happy one.
Took me a second to realize where I've seen this photo before. It was used as the cover of N.T. Wright's book After You Believe. I haven't read it but it's a follow up to his book Simply Christian (eBook only $2.99) which is most excellent for Christians and non-Christians alike trying to get familiar with the basics.
Edit: added links
Do you have time to read a book? The message in this changed my life and it sounds very relevant to the difficulties you're going through.
https://www.amazon.com/Victory-Over-Darkness-Realize-Identity/dp/0764213768/
The book is basically a huge dose of comfort, hope, and peace. It digs into the truth of who we are in Christ and shows that all things are possible through Jesus. Very comforting and hope-filled resource.
> You never seem to see people who start believing in God while still dealing with the criticisms atheists often have of religion
Though i don't agree with many things in the book, I guess you could consider this guy
I suggest that you check out Ordinary: Sustainable Faith in a Radical, Restless World by Dr Michael Horton next as a good counterbalance.
>in order to truly be destined for heaven, we should give up all worldly desires
Though a lot of people take what he says in this way--it's how he can come across--Platt would vehemently disagree with this characterization. No one goes to heaven by his own works.
>in constant pursuit of witnessing, making disciples, and spreading gospel throughout the world
This is literally impossible for most people, mainly because someone has to pay for it all. Witnessing is not the only good thing you can do. Fulfilling your vocation is a good work. Hold a job or run a business. This helps your neighbor. This lets you provide for your family. This lets you help meet the needs of other church members. None of these are necessarily witnessing, discipling, or evangelizing, but they are all good works.
I love talking about UR. Happy to respond. And if you thought your answer was long...
I should explain I grew up believing in the popular notion of hell, could uphold it with Scripture, etc. It wasn't until my late 20's that my brother challenged some of my assumptions. A few important conversations and this very even-handed book, combined of course with Scripture, has led me to abandon the popular notion of hell altogether. Overall, I embrace an agnostic view of hell which is very hopeful in the goodness and mercy of God. I am hopefully expectant of universal reconciliation, but am open to hell being a place of annihilation.
UR begins not with an engagement with texts about hell – which are rare! (and that rarity is itself may be telling). Instead, it begins with God. In particular, it takes into view two dominant understandings of God, seen in the OT but fully revealed in the NT. Namely: God's will is absolutely sovereign, and God's love embraces the whole cosmos. On the first point, I probably don't need much Scripture to prove my point, but my favorite is the simple profession of Job: "No purpose of yours can be thwarted." On the second, I take John 3:16 quite literally: "For God so loved the world." That doesn't prove a universal salvation, though. Instead, we have Peter's testimony that "The Lord ... is patient with you, not wanting any to perish, but all to come to repentance." Paul says the same to Timothy: "God our Savior ... desires everyone to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth."
Traditionally, these twin truths about God have seen impossible to reconcile in light of the popular notion of hell. So two compromised options have emerged.
One refuses to compromise God's sovereignty, and so re-reads the understanding of his loving will to save all of his creation. Somehow, God either denies love to some (the condemned) or by allowing their eternal damnation, this is a mysterious reflection of his love. He could save everyone (he is absolutely sovereign), but his will is not to save everyone. Otherwise, we would see that he does, and of course many march to their graves still enemies of God.
The other refuses to compromise the love of God, and so re-reads the understanding of his sovereign will to rule all of his creation. God wants everyone to be saved, but because he is "a perfect gentleman" he lets us have our way. This has a modern comfort to it, but if you take two steps back, you see God as able to intervene and prevent an eternal disaster, and he is content not to for the sake of preserving the integrity of our free will. The objection is of a parent watching a child walk into traffic. Surely the child's desire is immature and incomplete, and the parent has a responsibility to intervene. To respect the child's wishes is to be guilty of the worst neglect.
But those, really, are our only two paths. If, that is, hell is designed for everlasting torment.
URs say – what if God really does want everyone (and everything) to be saved, and he really will accomplish his purposes as the Sovereign of creation? What would that look like? So it begins with a high view of Scripture that constructs, I'd argue, a higher view of God than the other paths. And then, committed to that Biblical vision of God, it determines to walk with it through Scripture, to reassess what may need reassessing, and to notice what may have been ignored.
Broadly, I'd say there are three things URs bring up about Scripture that are vitally important for anyone grappling with God's final judgment.
What is hell for, then? For URs, it is for fulfilling justice – that is, paying for sins – and also for correction. The vast majority of God's punishing, even in the OT, is for a redemptive purpose. He exiles Israel to save it. Etc. Why can't hell be an extension of that purpose? (And, in light of that possibility, a lot of the troubling judgment in the OT becomes something along the lines of, "I'll deal with you later.")
This understanding of the inevitability of salvation also would explain how rarely hell makes an appearance in the teaching and preaching of the apostles. They don't call people to repent to avoid some unfathomably horrible punishment. Instead, they call people to repent because Jesus has made himself known as Lord. Judgment is often in view, an explicit hell almost never. Why not?
Most compellingly for me, though, is the famous Philippians passage about Jesus's exaltation. It says that every knee will bow, and explicitly this includes every knee "under the earth" – and "every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord." This is Paul, who uses exactly that formula to describe the path of salvation: "Confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord" is half of Romans 10:9, and it is hard to imagine that in the resurrection any will not "believe that God raised Christ from the dead." So Paul says there will come a day when everyone under the Earth has... done what is necessary for salvation. They have died once, and faced the judgment (Hebrews 9:27). That is not negated. What is explored is – what then?
Hope that helps! Happy to keep talking.
Have you read Jack Deere's Surprised by the Power of the Spirit? https://www.amazon.com/Surprised-Power-Spirit-Zondervan/dp/0310211271/
Here's a lengthy quote in response to what you're saying here. This is from Deere interviewing prospective students to get into Dallas Theological Seminary's doctorate program:
> When I asked him a third question, namely, what he believed about the miraculous gifts of the Holy Spirit, his confidence seemed to return. Undaunted, he replied that they were not given any longer. Again, his reason for this was that it was the plain teaching of the Scriptures. I asked him what he thought was the strongest evidence from the Bible to support the passing away of the miraculous gifts of the Spirit. “The Bible teaches that there are only three periods where miracles were common in the history of God’s dealings with his people. They were common during the time of Moses and Joshua, Elijah and Elisha, and Christ and the apostles—three periods of two generations each. The next time miracles will be common will be during the reign of the Antichrist and the great Tribulation,” he replied without a moment’s hesitation. “Did you arrive at this position from a careful inductive study of the Scriptures?” I asked. “That’s correct.” At this point, I knew he was not telling the truth. He did not come to that position from a careful study of the Scriptures. Benjamin Breckenridge Warfield, the Princeton theologian, had popularized that position at the beginning of the twentieth century, with the result that reformed and dispensational theologians have been using it ever since. One or more of us had passed this teaching on to the student, and now he was trying to claim that he had gotten it by careful study of the Scriptures. His dishonesty was a little more than I was willing to tolerate, so I said, “Let’s see if you can defend that position now. Let’s start with chapter one of Genesis and think our way through every chapter of the Old Testament to see if the biblical evidence supports your theory. Remember, we should only find three periods in which miracles are common. What took place in the first chapter of the Bible?” “That is where God creates the world.” “How about chapter two?” “That is the story of the creation of the world with man at the center.” “Chapter three?” “That is where the Devil comes to Adam and Eve and tempts them to sin, and God has to expel them from the garden.” “Are these things miraculous?,” I asked. “Well yes, but you have to start somewhere.” “O.K., fine. Chapter four?” “The first murder,” he said. “Chapter five is a genealogy. What happens in chapters six to nine?” “That is where God wipes out the whole earth with the flood and rescues eight people in an ark, on which species of every living animal have been miraculously summoned.” “Chapter ten?” “Another genealogy.” “Chapter eleven?” “The Tower of Babel, where God comes down and confounds the language of all the families of the earth.” “So really the first eleven chapters of Genesis don’t actually fit your theory, do they?” “Yes, but that is primeval history; I mean you expect things like that at the very beginning.” “O.K., for the sake of argument let’s dismiss the first eleven chapters of the Bible. At chapter twelve and for the rest of the book of Genesis we move into simple narrative biography. What happens in chapter twelve?” “God sovereignly calls Abraham to leave Ur of the Chaldeans and go to a land where he is going to begin a program to redeem the entire world.” “Anything else strike you as supernatural or miraculous elsewhere in Abraham’s life?” “Well, in chapter fifteen there was that supernatural smoking oven and flaming torch that passed between the parts of the sacrifice Abraham had laid out (Gen. 15:17). Besides the divine conversation in chapter 17, the Lord and angelic beings appear to Abraham in chapter 18 and eat with Abraham. Then there was the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah, when the heavens rained fire and brimstone on those cities (Gen. 19). Then there was the supernatural birth of Isaac in chapter twenty-one and the encounter with the angel of the Lord as he offered up Isaac on the altar in chapter twenty-two.” “So, the life of Abraham doesn’t really fit your theory that miracles or the supernatural are not common until the time of Moses and Joshua, does it?” “No.” “What about Isaac, Jacob or Joseph; anything there seem miraculous or supernatural to you?” “Chapter twenty-eight—the prophetic messianic vision of the angels ascending and descending on that ladder while Jacob slept.” “What else in Jacob’s life?” “Chapter thirty-two. He actually wrestles with God, or the preincarnate Christ, all night long. Then with Joseph there are all of those dreams and interpretations.” So I said, “As far as the evidence goes, the book of Genesis doesn’t fit your theory, does it?” “No.” “Now we are at the book of Exodus, and we have already said that Moses’ and Joshua’s life contain miracles and supernatural occurrences, so let’s skip from Exodus through the book of Joshua and come to the book of Judges. Anything in the book of Judges strike you as miraculous?” He said, “Well, the angel of the Lord actually appears to Gideon, and there is all that stuff going on with the fleece. Then the angel of the Lord appears to Samson’s parents, and there is the miraculous power of Samson.” “So the book of Judges doesn’t actually fit this theory, does it?” “No.” “What do you have in the book of 1 Samuel?” “A prophet whose words do not fall to the ground” (1 Sam. 3:19-21). And on and on the discussion went. In chapter after chapter the student was forced to list miraculous and supernatural occurrences that contradicted his assertion that miracles only occurred at three points in the history of Israel.1 The student was forced to admit not only that could he not defend his position, but that the Scriptures actually contradicted it.
Edit - I own the book and can send you my Kindle copy if you're interested in more. PM me an email and I'll send it your way.
What's So Great About Christianity by Dinesh D'Souza
Life After Death: The Evidence by Dinesh D'Souza
The New Evidence That Demand a Verdict by Josh McDowell
Check out "Finding God in the Waves: How I Lost My Faith and Found It Again Through Science," by Mike McHargue. It might be just what you are looking for :)
I am also posting this as an apologetic resource for you to use.
Why Christianity?
https://youtu.be/nWY-6xBA0Pk
Why suffering?
https://youtu.be/v6Gl4ao8IzA?t=9m6s
Evolution? Genesis?
Part 1
https://youtu.be/qMU1soRrtJk?t=26
Part 2
https://youtu.be/HZrxogY9Pnc?t=26
Part 3:
https://youtu.be/G7HQzhi8UPM?t=26
Part 4:
https://youtu.be/_3R0bh9LtSc?t=26
Part 5:
https://youtu.be/KJ3IgGYf29k?t=26
Part 6:
https://youtu.be/KCxWhKe1AMg?t=26
Part 7:
https://youtu.be/AyQY5Z3GeG4?t=26
Part 8:
https://youtu.be/eOwA9L0IY3I?t=26
Did Jesus exist?
https://youtu.be/A6uWSoxG_Fs
Jesus claimed to be God?
https://youtu.be/gT2TN6kA5kY
Trinity?
https://youtu.be/LoTSqXY5uhc
The good news?
https://youtu.be/HSNayo631a0
Homosexuality?
• A sin to exist?
https://youtu.be/COIThVReiIo
• A call to love?
https://youtu.be/nPYRXop7aPA?t=9s
Hell?
https://youtu.be/dz2EaQMBS3Y
All You Want to Know About Hell: Three Christian Views of God's Final Solution to the Problem of Sin
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00EQE3FJE/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_.o7HCb3HS6NG3
Never heard of Jesus?
Part 1
https://youtu.be/RvyzODL4B9U
Part 2
https://youtu.be/ufROkQF8rvg
Where did God come from?
https://youtu.be/RVzeojdXbpQ?t=9s
You might also enjoy these reads below,
Why Are There Differences in the Gospels?: What We Can Learn from Ancient Biography
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01MQFWQHD/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_QfzpCbWNBDNS2
The Resurrection of Jesus: A New Historiographical Approach
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B005LUJDNE/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_QizpCbDR7WP0G
Evidence That Demands a Verdict: Life-Changing Truth for a Skeptical World
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01MYP99J3/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_UoApCbAY8N4YN
Jesus Among Secular Gods: The Countercultural Claims of Christ
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01F1UD66I/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_u6wsCbDS1XXHR
Is God a Moral Monster?: Making Sense of the Old Testament God
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B004EPYPY4/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_3WypCbW728FHK
For starters, I'd recommend the following to get a taste of the issues we have to wrestle with when thinking about resurrection:
Liberating the Gospels: Reading the Bible with Jewish Eyes - here is an author who is almost immediately dismissed by the status quo of Christianity as being a crazy man. But in this book, he has been incredibly thorough in presenting evidence for his thesis. I know he writes other books where he speaks more generally, and I think that conservatives tend to seize this as an opportunity to attack without actually addressing the things he brings up in books like this one. Also by the same author, and related to this topic, you should check out:
The Fourth Gospel: Tales of a Jewish Mystic
Resurrection: Myth or Reality?
Related to Paul, you should read:
The First Paul: Reclaiming the Radical Visionary Behind the Church's Conservative Icon
There are three books by this duo, and they are all fantastic - very thorough, meticulous, and yet easy to read and understand. Related to this topic, you'd want to read:
The Last Week: What the Gospels Really Teach About Jesus's Final Days in Jerusalem
Another great book to understand where the debates lie in Jesus scholarship would be:
The Meaning of Jesus: Two Visions
These are really "get your feet wet" books. But really, one of the biggest problems with theology these days, I feel, is that it is all too often done without even an attempt to connect with science. We think we can argue "the Bible says" and stop there - as if that implies "so therefore this is what we have to believe". This is generally how scholars like N.T. Wright operate - they spend all kinds of effort laying out what the language says, but never really get into the questions of whether these things are tenable with today's knowledge of science, whether or not Paul actually might not have been the author of such things, whether there are contradictions between the gospels (or some of the writings attributed to Paul), etc. With scholars like Wright, it's just assumed that everything which was said was reliable and came from the actual people we have long said it came from - we never have to think about problems like science and historical methodology.
But if you really want to understand the problems surrounding resurrection, I think you need to study what science has to say about consciousness. A few books that come to mind off the top of my head:
The Future of the Mind: The Scientific Quest to Understand, Enhance, and Empower the Mind
Quantum Enigma: Physics Encounters Consciousness
And if you're really up for some fun with science and the question of eternity:
Biocentrism: How Life and Consciousness are the Keys to Understanding the True Nature of the Universe
The Self-Aware Universe
Please note: I don't think any of these books close the questions. They provide possibilities, for sure, and do so in a way that thoroughly wrestles with the evidence, logical problems, etc. But no one can prove or disprove afterlife, it seems. However, there are certainly many afterlife theories which simply do not work with modern science - literal bodily resurrection being one of them (if we're all going to be resurrected into physical bodies, how is our limited earth that is already stretched to the point of breaking going to support all those resurrected beings?).
Thanks for excerpt... I'm also reading N.T. Wright (for the first time but not the last).
A very recent book called How God Became King. He is such a deep and thought-through thinker. Very inspiring and eye-opening book.
Go read Borg and Crossan's The Last Week . https://www.amazon.com/Last-Week-Gospels-Really-Jerusalem/dp/0060872608
u/tathougies has it. There is legitimate reason for the gov't to support 1m1w marriage because it can (and usually) does produce children. Gov't has a vested interest in making sure those children are raised well. Yes, not all marriages produce children, please don't bring that up as if I'm unaware of it. Given they're the exception to the rule, it's not relevant.
There's no other valid reason for gov't to be involved in marriage, why does gov't care who you love? Does gov't care who your best friend is? No. So all this talk about love is irrelevant, you can love whomever you want but there's no reason for gov't to get in the middle of it unless there's children or the possibility of children.
I highly recommend "What is Marriage?" and "Correct, Not Politically Correct" for a lot more in-depth look at the subject. Neither quotes the Bible or relies on it to make their case. "Correct, Not Politically Correct" is a lot shorter and more "layman" in its approach. Plus it has a handy Q&A in the back.
Take care!