(Part 3) Top products from r/datingoverthirty

I think that you're going to have to try a bunch of things and see what you enjoy. It sounds like you haven't had the opportunity or drive to develop outside hobbies, and I'm going to venture a guess that during primary and secondary school you were raised in a culture that encouraged studying and very little else. So, now's the time to figure out what you like.

If you're somewhat into reading, I'd recommend The Girly Book Club. I'm a part of my local chapter, and it's a great way to meet fellow introverts and make some friends. Looks like there's a local chapter in Stuttgart: https://www.meetup.com/The-Stuttgart-Girly-Book-Club/.

Others have already mentioned using Meetup.com to find some groups you can join. Here is the link to the Leipzig, Germany meetup groups. Pick a few that sound interesting to try out.

Other ideas would be finding an organization on campus to get involved in--it could be related to an interest or career development. Volunteer somewhere for a cause that interests you, such as helping at an animal shelter since you love dogs. Take fitness classes or local cooking classes. Pick up photography. Learn to go hiking. Go geocaching. You can do a quick Google search for hobby ideas to get a list of things, and then try the ones that sound somewhat interesting to you. Also try a few things that you normally wouldn't--you never know what you might like!

As for the social skills, the good news is that they're skills and so you can learn and improve if you set your mind to it. There are videos, books and articles about things like body language, how to be a good conversationalist, how to connect with people more easily. Pick up a copy of How to Win Friends and Influence People. It's a classic for a reason. How to Talk to Anyone is also a good read.

You've got what I call the 30s depression...Office Space perfectly illustrates how many men feel in their 30s...

Fight Club gets it...

If you aren't in the gym lifting weights, I'd highly recommend it.
>I see them move from their offices to their cars and on to their suburban homes. They stress out constantly, they lose sleep, they eat badly. And they behave badly. Their egos run wild; they become motivated by that which will eventually give them a massive stroke. They need the Iron Mind. Through the years, I have combined meditation, action, and the Iron into a single strength. I believe that when the body is strong, the mind thinks strong thoughts. Time spent away from the Iron makes my mind degenerate. I wallow in a thick depression. My body shuts down my mind. ~ Henry Rollins, The Iron and The Soul

I know how you feel, we all do...a month off is a long time, especially for those who never get that amount of time off. If you can travel somewhere for a week or two - do it (go overseas, Thailand, Japan, Brazil, etc).

I've always believed everyone needs three things to be happy:

1. Someone to love - that's why we are here, being over 30 makes this even more difficult I know, just keep your mind open and don't waste any opportunities. We are social animals, spend time with friends and family if that's possible.
   
   
2. Something to do - this can be anything, upping your skills for a job (programming, math, reviewing old college text books, studying up on ASME, ASTM standards, etc), exercise (weights, yoga, running), learning a new language (Duolingo can be fun), anything you can think of! Having something with measurable goals can help because achieving something, anything will improve your mood and well being. Just remember - idle hands are the devil's workshop.
   
   
3. Something to look forward to - this can be a vacation (always planning that next vacation gives me a boost), a birthday, an event coming up...anything that you are truly looking forward to! I also link this to hope a little, we all look to the future so it may as well be a bright future. Like I said before, travelling solo is great, you're always on the go, you've got lots to see and do and you can meet a lot of people if you plan it right (check out r/solotravel) and stay and mingle in areas with other traveler's, especially solo travelers (like hostels).
   
   I'd like to recommend two books to help you out, Atomic Habits and Stealing Fire if you're interested in self improvement.

I'm sorry.

Chalk it up to a learning experience and move on.

I went back and read the other posts you wrote on this guy and it's not like I'm the big expert or anything but from the first date it just sounded like he just wasn't that into you (paraphrasing Greg Behrendt, btw I have recommended his book so many times it's like a broken record now...)

Notwithstanding all the guys here who are stating how much they would LOVE it if the girl made the first move and was proactive and aggressive... I'm here in my mid 50s to tell you that they might LOVE it if the girl made the first move and so on, there are outliers for sure, but bottom line is that males are hard wired to be the pursuers when it comes to women. They don't want the low hanging fruit - they want the shiny apple at the top of the tree.

I cringed as I read your posts because I've made the same mistakes too.

Buying him gifts when we aren't exclusive. Yup.

Proactively texting or reaching out - BTDT

Agonizing and ruminating about some breadcrumb guy for weeks.

Stalking him on his SM and obsessively checking to see if he's logged in to whatever dating app he's on. (Of course it goes without saying that he never did send me a friend request and at least I was smart enough not to send HIM one.)

If I hadn't been kissed by Date 2, I would move on.

Clearly he was fine spending time with you, but you weren't his oyster. But he didn't have the balls to tell you. Rejecting someone is even more difficult than being rejected. IMO that's why so many people ghost. I used to ghost too, but I realized that it's far kinder to tell the guy, often face to face, thanking him for meeting me but I'm just not feeling a romantic connection.

While you're on your dating sabbatical, you might want to do a bit of reading. I love recommending books that I've found personally helpful!

1. How to be Single and Happy just finished reading this one and it knocked my socks off!!!
   
   https://www.amazon.com/How-Single-Happy-Science-Based-Strategies/dp/0143130994
   
   
2. Hes Just Not That Into You and Its Just a Fucking Date by Greg Behrendt. You want a book by a real guy. Here it is! The title put me off reading it for a long time, but it's well worth it and stood the test of time for years since its publication (note the movie is NOT THE SAME AS THE BOOK.)
   
   
3. Love Factually by Duana Welch (and the sequel recently released). Why we do what we do when it comes to mating. Science based.
   
   Good luck to you!

I have read Mate

https://www.amazon.com/Mate-Become-Man-Women-Want/dp/0316375365

It is embarrassing to have read it but I found some of the exact same self help information in another book about controlling parents. I guess the good thing is I had also already done quite a bit of work the book recommended such as be in shape and take care of your mental health.

They had a podcast that had further recommended reading and advice such as

It's Not All About Me: The Top Ten Techniques for Building Quick Rapport with
Anyone

https://www.amazon.com/dp/057809665X/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_wstdzbP00CXWS

And taking improv comedy classes. All of which I have now done.

It really gave me a frame of reference I didn't have before. Very helpful in understanding not just romantic relationships but all relationships.

Seriously, you can just watch groundhogs day and get the gist of the book.

Edit: I heard about it through the Art of Manliness podcast. He did another one with another author who basically said stop reading self help books and just go out and have fun. I refuse to read another one.

Most of my exes remain friends, so I don't really have anything against seeing them. Again I guess I'm also pretty picky so I've never had the misfortune of dating a real psycho. I've also never tried to actually date within my own immediate team (I would agree that that feels a bit incestuous to me for some reason).

Where I currently work (a major fortune 500 multinational), about a quarter of my closest coworkers are married to other people in the company (and a bunch work in the same building. 2 of the 4 in particular work even on the same floor, but different departments). My current boss's wife used to share the same skip level manager with him, several years ago. The rest of us on the team rarely see them at lunchtime since they usually run off to eat with their spouses :) The oldest guy on my team is in his 50s and his second wife works downstairs and it's really cute every day at noon he goes "time to go collect my bride, see ya later!".

For the 2nd point I like to follow the advice given in the title of this memoir..

This is part of a series and it kind of broke my heart - but they're all good:

https://www.amazon.com/When-Parents-Forgot-Friends-About/dp/0764131729/ref=sr_1_13?ie=UTF8&qid=1543117725&sr=8-13&keywords=books+about+divorce+for+young+children

Maybe a bit too young for a 10 yo, esp if your child is a girl.

​

This is great but only for a good 10 yo reader... just deals with grief and tragedy in childhood well:

https://www.amazon.com/Thing-About-Jellyfish-Ali-Benjamin/dp/0316380849/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8&qid=1543117858&sr=8-10&keywords=books+about+divorce+for+young+children

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This too. I tried to read it but it broke my heart but it helped my son:

https://www.amazon.com/Things-We-Knew-Catherine-West/dp/0718078101/ref=sr_1_14?ie=UTF8&qid=1543118051&sr=8-14&keywords=books+about+divorce+for+young+children

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Edit: Mostly kids feel suddenly like things aren't as they should be and the fictionalized version of this in Young Adult (which is where 10 yos often are now, sadly) has a deep and awesome history going back to Judy Bloom.

>I'm not entirely sure if this is a general comment or directed at me. If directed at me, I'm not sure how you can garner regressive political leanings as I've never made my political orientation clear anywhere. I'm also not sure what is meant by regressive.

I was joking, mostly.

>I think this probably at the core of our discussion. I'm a trained natural scientist, which bleeds into other areas of life. Gravity is the same no matter what you believe for example. You jump off a bridge, you're not going to fly even if you believe so, you're going to go splat. So I struggle with the idea of moral relativism because I believe there are some things that universally apply and are universal truths so to say no matter what your values or what you choose to believe. It isn't necessarily politically or religiously motivated(for some people it is) It is just how I observe the world.

And didn't you ever read Mr. Tompkins in paper back?

I could swear there was something in the natural sciences relating to gravity and things being relative to the perspective of the observer... what was that again... the Heisenberg uncertainty principal... no no that's not it... planck's constant.... the second law of thermodynamic... never mind... I'm sure it will come to me...

>Is there an objective standard when it comes to the human condition? I do think there is, but it may be far more complicated than either of us can understand. I'm guessing that you would say there isn't an objective standard beyond what you've outlined due to your stance as a moral relativist.

Well the moral relativism was the product of a logical inquiry in to various differences in the ethical systems I observed in the world around me.

People have thought about all of these things before, Rousseau, Voltaire, Adam Smith, David Hume, John Locke, Plato. These are not new thoughts.

Basically the best we've come up with for a personal ethical standard is to not harm other unless they consent to be harmed. But not everyone is aware of that standard so it's difficult to impose it upon others.

Sounds like you had a bad date :-/ Sorry.

Yes, the dating world can be very cold to men that aren't attractive. It's not something that's discussed much, because it's hammered into our heads as kids that all you need to get the girl is a sense of humor, maybe a job, some confidence and a decent sense of style. But women can be every bit as superficial, unfortunately.

I wouldn't defend all the horrible shit that men have done to women throughout history, but this book should be enlightening reading for many women these days:

http://www.amazon.com/Self-Made-Man-Womans-Year-Disguised/dp/0143038702/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1458690380&sr=8-1&keywords=norah+vincent

All that said, though - if you realize you're a 2 or 3 out of 10, are you taking steps to improve? Have you been working out? Perhaps you need to dress better? Get on a diet?

I think Liberals and Conservatives alike could benefit from understanding a few things. One, personality usually dictates political leanings. So very likely many of the good things that you like about the man are some of the reasons he leans Conservative politically. Things like conscientiousness, work ethic, being protective of society at large and those he cares about can be part of a Conservative's mindset. You're a woman, so you're more likely to lean left/liberal from the get go. Women are higher in openness and empathy (in general).

I recommend reading this book, it's good science on how good people different in politics and religion: https://www.amazon.com/Righteous-Mind-Divided-Politics-Religion/dp/0307455777/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1521426339&sr=8-1&keywords=the+righteous+mind

But my personal take is as a society we've become so polarized that we won't just listen to each other without immediately thinking someone that disagrees with us is the enemy. I think if we could be more open minded, we'd find wonderful people that choose to vote differently but complement each other because we bring different qualities and perspectives that can balance each other out. The alternative is seeking a sycophantic partner that echoes our beliefs and doesn't challenge us.

I have a great texting penpal, thanks to Reddit (and this person being so compassionate and helpful); and she has been a mainstay in my life in the last month or so. But I know better than to sully dating endeavors with such a communication form. Statistics show that a line gets drawn in the sand by the sixth round of exchanges (whether msg, text, or email). If you haven't met up by then, the probability falls to about 0% at that point. OLD is NOT for penpalling. These guys you matched with, OP, either are not serious about dating and/or have no idea what they're doing.

Everyone should read Modern Romance, cull the appropriate guidelines for their gender, and just systematize the whole thing.

It's "Wolves of Eden: A Novel"
I haven't finished it but it's really good so far. I would suggest taking a look at it if American historical fiction is up your alley.

Wolves of Eden: A Novel https://www.amazon.com/dp/0393652041/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_FWdRDbNW7J7SP

Sounds like borderline personality disorder honestly.

Wow, the Kirkus review is a tour de force!

If you search on Amazon

The title starts with "If I'm" not "If you're"

And How to Break Your Addiction to a Person.

Alright. Triage time.

Read this:

https://bookofpook.neocities.org/

Then read this:
https://www.amazon.ca/dp/0345816021/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_jzi1CbGEN5P3Y

Then take some of that 6 figures you make and allocate it to fucking off.

Use this:

https://earthroulette.com/

Fuck off wherever it tells you, book a flight, and go away for 2 weeks minimum. When you get there, pick a random direction and travel that way till you hit water or 2-3 weeks are up.

You need a reset and a change of scenery. Get your head screwed back on straight, clear your thoughts and get out of your rut.

But here's the thing: it's totally okay to feel like this and be fed up. Dating as an activity sucks giant donkey dick for everybody that's left. It's a grind and a treadmill, and sometimes the beat thing to do is hit the stop button and step off. Fuck all that noise, it's garbage.

Reset, take a sabbatical, go somewhere. Then come back with a new perspective.

>In that year alone, I must have rejected/turned down at least two dozen different women. I'd usually feign interest in them, then ignore/dump them quickly thereafter. To this day, I have no idea why this is. I don't know why I felt so angry towards women.

I wonder if it's because you view the world through a framework of hierarchies and inadequacy.

You've put yourself under tremendous pressure to excel, to be worthy, only to repeatedly fail to reach your own standards. So along come these attractive women who want to be with you, which must feel very validating. Also, they're more or less strangers, so there's no consequence if you dick them around. Basically, rejecting these women gives you the opportunity to be the one doling out disapproval rather than the one experiencing it. Instead of feeling contempt for yourself, you can project it onto others and then watch from a position of emotional safety.

>Oh, another thing that I enjoy doing is hating myself, or self depreciation. Again, I don't know why I do this. But when I try to answer these questions, I'll tell myself things like: "You'll never get married, nobody could ever love you the way you are. You're a loser, you can't do anything right, you fuck everything up, just fucking kill yourself".

I used to verbally beat up on myself when I was younger. It's fucking miserable but it's also very satisfying. Plus it even feels virtuous in a sick way - look I'm not being a jerk to others, I'm being a martyr by being a jerk to me!

One of the most useful things ever said to me was by my ex boyfriend after witnessing me berating myself again. He looked me dead in the eyes and with a voice that was gentle but also clearly over my shit he said

"You know, when you beat up on yourself you are the most self important person in the world." It stopped me cold because I immediately knew he was right.

To be frank, there's a lot of ego involved in self hatred. Casting someone down in a ditch is just the flip side of putting them up on a pedestal. Seriously, compare the following:

• "God, I'm so incredibly fucked up. I'm just epically fucked up. No one is more inexcusably fucked up than me. I'm just so purely, irredeemably bad! I should just die because there's nothing I can or should do."
  
• "I have some real issues that I have let go on for far too long. I really need to address that shit, and if it's beyond my power to do it alone, I should reach out for help."
  
  One of those lines of thoughts makes you the Chosen One of assholes and absolves you of the need to make changes because change is impossible. The other one makes you just another person who has to sort out their issues, even if it means some really uncomfortable work.
  
  I'll echo what others have said about therapy. It sounds like you've spent a long, long time living with your self-imposed judgement, anger and shame. Originally it was meant to spur you on to improve yourself, but it's really just held you back. I think that having a third party to both hold you accountable while also offering you a more even-handed perspective could be immensely helpful to you.
  
  Since it sounds like you have struggled with a perfectionist mindset, you might also find this article interesting. I read it maybe 10 years ago and it helped to articulate some of the self-defeating attitudes I'd held about academic achievement. Carol Dweck's work is worth checking out if you'd like to develop a more resilient response to setbacks.
  
  I have also found the written exercises in The Feeling Good Handbook by Burns to be very helpful. They're designed to help you examine your self-talk and develop a more accurate view of yourself and the world.
  
  But first and foremost making an appointment with a university therapist is a good step. I suspect that once you address your mental health, your dating life will sort itself out. From what you write, you're aware that you need to work on your issues and that you have an amazing opportunity to begin a new chapter in your life.
  
  Good luck OP. Change can be hard, but sometimes it's actually easier than continuing to tread water. There is no reason you can't create a better life for yourself, and no reason you don't deserve to.

Don't answer the question. You don't owe them an answer just because they ask it. If you answer it, you're training those rude people that it's OK for them to ask you rude questions.

Right now, you're dreading part of what you'd like to be a good family time. If you refuse to be done in by their rudeness, then you need not dread any more in the future.

Getting a girlfriend isn't going to solve the problem, because then they'll ask when you're getting married, and then after that they'll ask when you're going to have a baby and then after that they'll ask when you're going to have another one, because these people don't understand that what they're asking is none of their damn business.

Some people suggest cutesy non-answers like your "I guess I haven't met the right gal yet" or even "I haven't found anyone as nice as you, Aunt Marge", but I don't think that's best. Those invite further discussion of the topic. If you don't want to talk about it, then shut it down unambiguously.

Here are some suggestions:

• "I'm sorry, but that's not something that seems appropriate at Thanksgiving."
  
• "I don't think that's something that you and I would discuss."
  
• "I'm sorry, but that's personal."
  
  You can let those responses lie there and let the silence do the talking, or you can deflect to another topic as you have in the past.
  
  Again, you don't owe these people an answer. If they respond with arguments, then repeat your answer.
  
  "So why aren't you with a girl?" "I'm sorry, but that's personal." "Aw come on, we're all family here, do you have your eye on someone?" "I'm sorry, but that's personal." "It's no big deal, I'm just wondering, did you have a bad breakup or something?" "I'm sorry, but that's personal."
  
  Repeat it until they get it. It might be awkward for a minute, but the long-term dividends are fantastic.
  
  For more about this sort of dealing with rude nosey people, I highly recommend this book: https://www.amazon.com/Miss-Manners-Basic-Training-Right/dp/0609600516